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Ontario Highway Traffic Act

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PostPosted: Mon Feb 16, 2009 9:18 pm 
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PetitionGuy wrote:
BTW.....with the HANS devise, I've seen plenty of race cars PLANT at over 200MPH and the organs are fine as are the drivers....obviously there's a big difference in how folks are strapped in road cars versus race cars, but the body can withstand plenty and this 130 fatal zone is another wank

.....not that race cars are designed for not only speed, but impacts at those speed, the driver in their protective suits, the tracks that are designed with most often glancing strikes and slide offs into a level surface, emergency personal with state of the art equipment right at scene.

.....as compared to plain civilian cars going out of control striking bridge pillars, trees, rock faces, going over embankments, down into ditches, etc....driver not having any protection other than a 15km/hr designed bumper and 30km/hr designed crumple zone...

....except for maybe one or two others on this forum, I see the carnage regularily, I have see people thrown out of their vehicles only to be crushed by their own vehicle, I have seen vehicles collide, fly, roll into almost everything that is imaginable. I have seen body parts scattered across a scene, part of my investigation is going to autopsies, sometimes I have to speak to next-of-kin........

.......it's all fine and dandy to arm chair why the speed should be increased (b/c the the driver next to me does it), but take a walk/day in an emergency responders shoes to see needless collisions, injury and death at the speed we already have.

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PostPosted: Tue Feb 17, 2009 1:06 am 
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Okay hwybear i must admit i do agree with what alot of you say.

So okay ill agree lets say the human body can with stand a crash at 130 km/hr. Here is my response

1. The rest of the world (england, germany, france) drive everyday at 130 km/hr (official limit 120-130). They live to tell the tale. In fact they also do this in much older cars which do not have as many safety features.

2. Secondly they're high ways are not always the exact same speed limit. That is one thing i do not understand about Ontario highways. I take a drive down the QEW. The lanes are crammed, its dangerous, not only that there is so much traffic volume and there is only wood and some aluminum separating you and the next lane on the other side of the road!!!!

3. Accidents may be fatal but we may have more of them. Higher speeds may cause more dangerous crashes but we need to look at the causes of our fatal crashes. Usually it isnt high speeds. I have no idea but i guess most "fatal" crashes are caused by poor weather conditions, poor lane changes, tailgating, and DISTRACTIONS.


4. There is many studies and evidence to also show there might be less accidents and fewer deaths with higher speed limits. This improves lane discipline. Also as i can guess more drivers tend to focus more on driving and less on other distractions as speed limits increase. Ill tell you all those ones that are zooming around you on the highway. They may be dangerous but boy do they ever look focused on driving.


How safe is that if a transport truck or a large pickup flies through that head on to your car. Even if your going 70 that could be fatal.

Take a drive down the 401 just outside of Toronto. It's 3 and 4 Lanes. The lines are wide. They have massive shoulders. Not only to the 5-7 feet on the inside and outside shoulders they're is a massive concrete barrier between you and the other side incase someone plows through.

So can someone tell me why the 401 East from Toronto to Montreal has the same speed limit as the QEW.


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PostPosted: Tue Feb 17, 2009 1:13 am 
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One more thing i have always thought about what a higher more realistic speed limit around where 85 percent of cars actually drive. Lets say a speed limit of 120-130 km/hr seems to be where most are at now.

1. This would get the super slow drivers off 400 series highways. Those that dont feel comfortable at this speed which often cause major problems would not come on the roads. They would take smaller highways to get there. This would improve traffic flow.

2. You would have better lane discipline. You would have less of those going so much slower than then rest of traffic plugging the passing lanes causing road rages, passing on the right, and other dangerous manoveurs to pass other traffic.

3. A realistic speed limit would also give a chance for officers to really focus on the "speeders." If they called stunt driving 170-180 km/hr then well this is starting to get well beyond what some may cruise at. This also requires a better than your average honda civic.

4. A speed limit people see as realistic they may follow better. They may have more respect for others on the road, police, and traffic laws in general.

5. Another problem with 100 is you can't travel at this speed. Just try this anywhere around Toronto on a 400 series highway you can't do it. You'll get honked at, tailgated, passed, cut off. Why must you be forced to break the law to drive?


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PostPosted: Tue Feb 17, 2009 1:16 am 
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tdrive2 wrote:
5. Another problem with 100 is you can't travel at this speed. Just try this anywhere around Toronto on a 400 series highway you can't do it. You'll get honked at, tailgated, passed, cut off. Why must you be forced to break the law to drive?


Because if you set higher speed limits there will always be a few inconsiderate A-holes who will break those higher speed limits too, and they will honk at you when you drive exactly 120 on a marked 120, because they want to go their 30 over the limit.

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PostPosted: Tue Feb 17, 2009 1:20 am 
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this just isn't going away

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PostPosted: Tue Feb 17, 2009 1:39 am 
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racer wrote:
tdrive2 wrote:
5. Another problem with 100 is you can't travel at this speed. Just try this anywhere around Toronto on a 400 series highway you can't do it. You'll get honked at, tailgated, passed, cut off. Why must you be forced to break the law to drive?


Because if you set higher speed limits there will always be a few inconsiderate A-holes who will break those higher speed limits too, and they will honk at you when you drive exactly 120 on a marked 120, because they want to go their 30 over the limit.


Fair enough but then why wouldn't you just move to the right. I understand your argument but anything with a 120 limit would have 3 lanes.

This is one thing i never get with drivers. I dont know what it is. When i drive i always am aware and watching in front and my rear view mirror. If i see a car coming up that is moving way faster i just let him pass me. Even if i cant i put on my right turn signal to show that i am not trying to piss him off and i will get out of his way ASAP. I never get tailgated......

If its at night or the road isnt busy as soon as i see someone moving faster than me i just move right..... It not hard to do.

I noticed 2 things also. If i don't move out of the way i cause a small traffic jam of cars behind me that tailgate me to move. Or the driver has Zero patience and will just swerve through everyone else to pass me.

Technically the only "driving lane" is the right most lane. I understand that you may not like others honking at you for going 120. But this would most likely not be the case. If your not inconveniencing someone else and allowing them to pass you, you have the choice to drive at 120. Just move over.....

Ive see people do it all the time. Once you pass them youll see 2 cars in the 2 left most lanes. They are causing a major backup because they wont let others pass them.


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PostPosted: Tue Feb 17, 2009 10:01 am 
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tdrive1.....agree with everything you said.....almost :wink: except that any day you can travel thru Toronto at 100.....I have never been able to do that.....always hit some traffic jam :D

think that the items we all keep alluring back to is unsafe driving habits (left lane hogs, signalling, lane changes, follow too close etc...). The unsafe driving habits combined with speed = a mess

Toronto is a classic example, people waiting until the last minute after roaring down the left lane to cross 2 or more lanes of traffic to get to their exit. Instead of gradually moving over not affecting others. People merging into the 401 and non-highway speeds, forcing others to brake, reducing their following distance and causing rear-end collisions. Vehicle "jockying" for position (switching lanes in slow traffic) just to get another 30 feet farther down the road.

So what to do about this? Driver education through every year of school? Simulator driving (so Bookm can kick our butt) and people have to have so many hours with a passing grade? Or is there piss-poor time management skills on that many people, they have to rush to work?

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PostPosted: Tue Feb 17, 2009 1:43 pm 
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I have driven on the autobahn and the one thing that is absolutely clear is that it is unforgiving in the way it is designed.

In Ontario several kms before an exit sign we get a warning sign that it's coming up. We might get two more warnings before finally coming to the huge exit sign.

In Germany there is one warning sign 50 - 100 metres in advance and then the exit. If you miss the exit, you can't take the next exit and circle back. Most exits lead to another road or highway and you cannot turn around for many, many kms. The cost of missing the exit is brutal.

Also the speed limit can go from "unlimited" to 50km/h in just under 200 metres. Many of the (speed limit and lane restriction) signs are digital which means they can change anytime depending on traffic flow.

If you don't pay attention, the consequences are viscous. From ending up miles from home to death, the roads seemed to be designed to "cull the herd" of inattentive drivers.

Other design elements: major fines for passing on the right, trucks restricted to only one lane and slower speeds, and using rails and safety barriers to remove the scenery and force drivers to concentrate on the road.

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