Bad Wreck down the road...

While raking leaves in the rear yard around 11:30am on a warm, sunny Easter morning, my wife and I heard the unmistakable sound of a bad wreck at the intersection a 1/4 mile from our house. It's a rural intersection, paved in both directions, stop signs in one direction. I ran out to the road and saw a black van on it's side and another car sitting all crooked in the intersection. I hollered for my wife to call 911, then jumped in my car to head to the scene.

Upon arrival:

- The van was a black Chrysler mini-van (newer) which had a full family of two 30'ish males, a 30'ish female, two young children, and an elderly lady. By the time I arrived, all occupants were out sitting on the ditch bank at the side of the road, except the elderly lady and her grandson who was inside holding her head up. The van had clearly rolled over, all windows were smashed out, and it came to rest on its passenger side.

- The car was a smaller, silver/grey cookie-cutter economy car of unknown make, as the front end was all smashed up. It only had one driver, a male in his late 20's. He was sitting along the opposite ditch holding his neck and head.

It seemed like hours, but in only minutes the first ambulance arrived. Because the crash occurred on the city limits, both city and neighboring township emergency crews responded. Within 15-20 min's, there were 4 ambulances, 5 fire trucks, 2 OPP, and 4 city cruisers. The windshield was sawed out and the elderly lady was removed and loaded in one ambulance. The female passenger received treatment on-scene then loaded in to another ambulance. The driver of the car received a neck brace and was also taken by ambulance. In fact, the only passengers who seemed to escape unscathed were the two children and the driver of the van. All van occupants were clearly seat belted in, but the broken windows caused some cuts and bleeding.

The fact that the kids were just fine shows just how important children's car seats are! Remember, this was a ROLLOVER accident. When I was kid in the 60's, I used to lay on the rear window pan and watch the big cars following us. Those days are HISTORY! I'm not sure if the guy in the car was wearing his belt. I heard him on his cellphone say he hit his head on the windshield, so I doubt he was wearing it.

I spoke with a jogger who was almost struck by the sliding/spinning van. As easy as it was for me to assume the car was at fault (how could a fine, respectable family be at fault, right?) it turns out the van failed to obey the stop sign, didn't see the car coming (gray car against a gray asphalt road) and drove through the intersection into the path of the unlucky guy in the car. He clipped the passenger side of the van (hard) and turned it over.

As the small crowd that had gathered started discussing the incident, I was rather shocked when one guy said, "that car was probable going too dam fast", and others gently nodded in agreement. I just looked at these people and wondered what the heck is wrong with them. Is that really what this province has become? A bunch of mindless zombies who have been brainwashed into thinking speed must be at the root of all wrecks?? Every one KNEW that the van full of family members just simply drove through a stop sign, but because they were a nice, decent family, surely it can't be their fault. Must be the single male driver of the car. Must have been speeding. Yep, That's it. (Groan... people are nuts)

That's what you get when you create a nanny state.. There was a thread on a motorcycle forum about a guy who stopped at a Stop sign at an intersection with a major road. Without properly looking, he decided to proceed. Fortunately, he stalled his car and didn't hit the motorcyclist who was going in front of him, as per his right of way. The thread was all about the car driver complaining about the motorcyclist's recklessness. While I understand his point of view, up to a point, but the bottom line was that he was about to enter the intersection without properly checking the traffic that had the right of way and was blaming others for their speed instead of himself for his inattention.

Speed may increase the severity of damage to yourself, your property, others and their property. It may also decrease the time that others have to correct their mistake and increase the chance of you making a mistake. However, the worst killer on the roads is lack of due care and attention. That's what we should really be focusing on.

It really sucks that violating the speed limits is easy to enforce, prove in court and collect money on.

I should add:

There was absolutely no evidence of excessive speed on the cars part. It must not have had anti-lock brakes, because we heard the screech before the bang and there was about 15ft. of skid marks (speed limit 70kph). It was banged up but no where near what high speeds would have produced.

And even if the car driver had been speeding, he'd have to be doing at least twice the speed limit for him not to be reasonably anticipated by turning traffic. Under those circumstances, there would have been no survivors.

Too many people turn or make a lane change without looking and blame the other vehicle operator's speed, especially when they profile by the operator's age and/or choice of vehicle.

First of all (not that I had any doubt that you would, but still) good job in responding ASAP to the crash. Sounds like a stupid comment to make, but I've seen enough people literally drive by crashes without doing anything. Or worse, I stopped at a collision, got out to help the injured, and had someone roll down his windows: "Wow, that looks like it hurt," and drive off, no call to 911, nothing. At least it sounds like most of the people had minor injuries, hopefully they're all okay.

People give into stereotypes so easily: Young male in his 20s in a collision. Hmm... "Young drivers go too damn fast." "Those punk kids cause all the crashes." "Speed kills." Anyone can cause a crash. A collision occurred in front of my apartment building a few months ago: Driver of a Cadillac (young male) was proceeding down the main road in heavy traffic, car turned left in front of him, CRUNCH. After calling 911, I ran over to see if I could help, but in the two minutes it took to get there the police had already arrived. Same thing came from the peanut gallery. The Cadillac driver was, among other things: going too fast, a damn punk, a stupid punk kid, a street racer, someone who deserved to lose his car. None of them actually SAW the crash. The peanut gallery was shocked when the police officer walked over to the lady who made the left turn: "Ma'am, you are being charged under the Highway Traffic Act of Ontario with careless driving," and handed her the Provincial Offences Notice. I had to suppress a smirk, not at her, but at the peanut gallery. No one was seriously hurt in the collision, FYI.

Then again, anytime there is a major incident, be it a car crash, fire, police shooting/takedown, airplane crash or whatever, everyone has to put their two cents in. I'm guessing that's what the guy was doing when he said "the car was probably going too damn fast."

Good job responding to crash within minutes! Paramedics' most often complain about getting to the scene too late, sometimes by just minutes.

Left turns.... Once, back a few years age, I was driving with my mother along Main St. in Hamilton, near Queen St. (Main there is 5 lane, one-way, speed limit 50, lights all timed for 60 hehe). We were in the 4-th lane (5-th is used for parking, parking prohibited on the 1-st lane due to bus routes), when a lady, must be in her 70-s, with another older gentleman also in the same age group, signals left. I slowed down a bit (to 55 from 60), thinking she wanted to change lanes. NOPE. Made a left turn, not from the leftmost lane, not even from from lane adjacent to that, but from 3-rd lane in... I was a new driver at the time, and I always had my left foot at the brake, had I not had it there it might have been a crash. And her insurance must have been 3 times lower than mine...

Last season, I was in the left lane and a guy driving an old green Escort wagon was making a right out of the right lane. Just as I'm about to pass him, he decides to swing over to the left without looking or signalling. Fortunately, I'm always on the ball and managed to stop 6" from his car. Had he done that a second sooner, I would have been seriously hurt (even at 50km/h, tumbling over a car and onto the pavement can inflict a lot of damage) or run over and dead. He's lucky I got over the raw fear 2min later. Had I been more coherent, I would have chased the bastard down. Had I been driving a car, I would have just stepped on it in hopes of hitting him as hard as possible and claimed that my foot slipped off the brake pedal.

Bookm wrote:

... didn't see the car coming (gray car against a gray asphalt road) and drove through the intersection into the path of the unlucky guy in the car. He clipped the passenger side of the van (hard) and turned it over.

Great. Now insurance rates will increase for grey cars due to the fact that they are harder to see on the road, thus increasing their chances of collision. Red cars' insurance is higher, despite the fact that red and bright-orange cars are least likely to be in an accident (% wise, makes sense - red=danger. Bright orange similar to red).

racer wrote:

Bookm wrote:

... didn't see the car coming (gray car against a gray asphalt road) and drove through the intersection into the path of the unlucky guy in the car. He clipped the passenger side of the van (hard) and turned it over.

Great. Now insurance rates will increase for grey cars due to the fact that they are harder to see on the road, thus increasing their chances of collision. Red cars' insurance is higher, despite the fact that red and bright-orange cars are least likely to be in an accident (% wise, makes sense - red=danger. Bright orange similar to red).

And yellow cars to be purchased by drivers with records...so everyone around can use "caution".

Green cars to go fast

Blue for our blue hair drivers on the road.

Brown for pieces of .... (ah you know what I mean) cars, that have no insurance and are falling apart.

I drive a black car, does that mean I can drive at night and not be scene???

racer wrote:

Great. Now insurance rates will increase for grey cars due to the fact that they are harder to see on the road, thus increasing their chances of collision.

I have a grey car. Terrific...

racer wrote:

Paramedics' most often complain about getting to the scene too late, sometimes by just minutes.

I don't quite understand what you mean by that....

Kudos to Bookm for rendering assistance. Too many people these days just drive by without giving a second thought about the people involved. Some argue they don't have the tools...true, but simply one's presence can provide much relief to accident victims.

I have always expressed that speed in itself does not kill. As mentioned, it does reduce reaction time, and increases the severity of both bodily and property damage. Most collisions are rooted in inattention. If you rear-end another vehicle at 60 km/h, it's because you were not paying attention. If you get hit head-on at the crest of a hill because the other driver is in your lane, his inattention is the cause.

Many people do not look towards their intended direction while maneuvering their cars. The follwing link is to an article about a collision whose cause, in my opinion, is pure driver inattention. http://www.northernlife.ca/News/Policea ... n070409008

Car Vs. Tractortrailer....... No brainer, so is a U-turn in front of a truck. There are many causes of accidents, speed can be one of them, however it's not the only one. I wonder how much of a decrease we would have if we trained young drivers properly????

To be honest though, I'm not real good with the sight of blood. And the first aid course I took over 10 years ago is virtually useless to me now. So there's no way I was rollin' in there to take control of the entire situation. But I think there's several things fellow citizens CAN do at "fresh" accident scene such as keeping an eye out for secondary hazards such as leaking fuel, approaching traffic, traumatized victims wandering on the road, downed power lines, engines still running (or fuel pumps still running),... just small things that many extra eyes just might pick up on.

In this case, I hopped out (left my hazard lights on in the middle of the road) and made a quick visual scan of the scene. I could see a woman's arm and hand extending from a broken window (with a little blood) but was quite glad to see her fingers moving (phew!). It was clear that this lady would be hanging sideways in her seatbelt, as the van was on its side. I asked a guy who was pulling stuff out of the van if anyone was helping her. He said her grandson was inside holding her up in the seat and could manage it by himself. I know many injuries occur when well-intentioned folks move injured people unnecessarily, causing further injury, so I didn't jump in and help (though I would have if requested).

Somebody has to take charge of the scene, especially in cases where there's no breathing or heavy bleeding. My instructor told me to think of the person as a corpse. If you can't help them, you can't make'em any deader, if you save their life, it's a huge bonus, so you might as well try.

Note for those who come across a motorcycle accident. DO NOT allow the victim to REMOVE the HELMET or remove it yourself. Removing a helmet can aggravate neck and spinal injuries, so that should be done by licensed medical professionals. The only exception should be if the person is not breathing (chest not moving or mirror not fogging up) or choking on their blood.

Similar car vs. truck collision happened near Peterborough last summer. Young woman made a sudden U-turn in front of a transport truck, everyone in the car died. I don't know if basic survival instincts have been dulled over time, but I can't help but wonder why so many people just impulsively do things without looking and verifying that the action wouldn't result in being killed. It's not that hard to realize that driving is the most dangerous thing that most of us do, but every single day I see all kinds of people do things that, if it weren't for pure luck, would end up killing them.

FiReSTaRT makes an excellent point. I advise people to not remove people from cars/trucks (i.e: unconcious) unless such action puts their life in danger, such as fire, drowning, etc...

An example is an MVC which I attended in November. Head-on collision between Cavalier and Sunfire/Grand Am. Vehicle speeds were approx. 97 km/h and 88 km/h at point of impact, no braking. Father in Cavalier had 2 broken ankles and driver of Pontiac suffered fractured leg, both arms, moderate-severe head injury due to a toolbox in back seat which opened. The patient that illustrates my point is the daughter, passenger in the Cavalier. She was unconcious and bystanders did not remove her from the vehicle as there was no obvious life-threatening danger. Another crew put her in a c-collar and the entire kit. She had full movement and sensation in all four limbs (she regained consciousness en-route to the ER). We later learned she had fracture her C2 (2nd cervical vertebrae), and the general rule for c-spine fracture is "above C4, you breath no more". So, because the bystanders did not attempt to move her, she can still walk, run, take care of herself, and have normal teen and adult years.

Stay safe!!

Good point Radar i have seen this many times.

Women on cell phones changing lanes not even paying attention.

Those people really bug me, they check their email's make phone calls and do not even care at all. They are driving half in one lane.

These people deserve Careless driving charges.

I mean come on atleast if your gonna talk on your cell for a while or check your mail on your blackberry could you have the common sense to pull over to the right lane?

Radar it amazes me that people do things that stupid without even thinking like doing a uturn in front of a transport.

I love those big concrete barriers on the 401. I cant imagine how many loonies would try to do a uturn on there with people coming head on at 120+

I hate the concrete barriers.

If only the gov't did it correctly like hwy 11 up towards Huntsville, where the lanes are seperated by a good 75metres. It allows ample room to remove snow, debris off the highway. Allows emergency vehicles to get to scenes and calls for service more efficiently. Prevents rubbernecking as the distance allows nothing to be seen.

tdrive2 wrote:

Radar it amazes me that people do things that stupid without even thinking like doing a uturn in front of a transport.

People just don't think when they're driving "hey, if I make a big mistake, or someone else makes a big mistake and I don't take evasive action, I could die." Another example was the woman here in Toronto who was chatting on her cellphone, walked into the side of a truck and was crushed under its wheels. Just about every week at Victoria Park and Lawrence I see someone in the right turning lane zip across to the left turning lane without looking for traffic coming up behind them (that's crossing three lanes).

hwybear wrote:

I hate the concrete barriers.

Might work for rural areas, but the tall-wall is a necessity in the major cities.

I also love the tall concrete wall cause the officer can't pull a U and run around to flash his lights on after he gets you with the spectre.

It is absolutely necessary in Major Cities.

A transport can go through the grass like nothing. The QEW is scary they still have those wood posts with the aluminum, or w.e it is.

A big transport can fly through that like nothing, many have died like this in head on collisions.

Theres one for you guys who love the speed kills argument. If a transport truck goes through the median and hits your car head on what happens at the following speeds????

a) 90 km/hr

b) 110 km/hr

c) 130 km/hr

d) 150 km/hr

e) Your just as dead.

Well ya chances are even if it hits you at 70 head on your dead the speed wont make a difference. The answer was e.

Now d was a trick question. Why may you ask cause fantino would have towed his truck before his day in court

Sometimes out west of london there is enough room to have a large grass median int he middle.

but in most urban areas there is simply no room for this.

I would rather have the concrete in the middle to stop trucks from flying through, with wider lanes, and perhaps a chance to expand the highway to fit another lane as opposed to something cops can use front facing radar to pull a U turn to catch speeders.

I remember that guy who went 250 on the 400. With grass in the middle or wood he could have flew threw that and hit me head on.

With a big concrete median he can smash his own car into a big slab of concrete and kill himself.

Transport going thru the median at whatever km/hr...add the vehicle speed the opposite way and then you have the speed of impact...BAM!!

I have seen several trucks go right thru the super duper concrete barriers.

Of course you need them in major cities, gov't still didn't plan the routes wide enough to start with, so there is not choice but to concrete it up....the motor vehicle "luge" was born

I have mixed feelings about the concrete barriers. A divided roadway with a small forest in between is ideal, but I don't think I've seen any of those in Ontario.

The tall-walls like to bounce cars back into traffic, but they work with a larger range of car sizes and bumper heights. The metal guardrails are a little better at catching vehicles or at least gently steering them back to the road, but they're a one-time-use deal. At least we don't have those Autobahn barriers where a low car can slot right under it.

I've had good experiences with the concrete barriers on the QEW..

1) In a K-car, got slammed into it by a van shooting across 3 lanes of traffic without looking. Some cosmetic damage. I dread the thought of what could have happened had there not been one.

2) In an 85 Jetta, got hit so hard by a Mercedes that had a tire blowout while passing from the right that he took 2 tires off my rims.. Again, I went into the barrier, no other major damage or injuries.

I think the concrete barriers are great on the 400-Series in the GTA. Probably has saved quite a few lives.

Several years ago the 427 had those metal W-barriers that we've still got on much of the QEW. A truck had a catastrophic steering failure, crashed through the barrier and into oncoming traffic. It slammed head-on into a car, killing the driver, and seriously injured another motorist. After that MTO replaced the metal barriers with concrete on the 427.

Squishy wrote:

A divided roadway with a small forest in between is ideal, but I don't think I've seen any of those in Ontario.

Highway 416 between the 401 and Ottawa has this for most of its distance. Also the 417 between Ottawa and Montreal for some of the way. The only downside is that the forest also has a lot of animals, like deer, moose, and, of course, a puma with a light deck.