Hi everyone, About a month ago, I got a funny situation where a cop made a u-turn to stop in a very showy fashion (that scared and surprised me) because he almost hit me while doing that. Anyhow, he claimed that he metered me while he was driving towards me so he said his car is equipped to meter opposite coming cars as he drives. I filed the ticket and I was convicted within few days - an administrative error on part of the filing office. So, they fixed the issue and give me a court date only 5 months after I was issued the ticket which is sometime in Oct/Nov of 2011. My questions are as follows: 1- Where and how can I apply to get the officer notes and gather all the information that is with the crown to fight this? 2- Are the police cars really equipped with radars to check speed of oncoming cars as they are driving themselves? 3- Since I don't think the timing is enough for me what can I do to postpone this to another time? I mean usually in Toronto it takes almost 2 years for your turn to come in court while this came in about 5 months time (I think only because of the administrative issue) Thanks
Hi everyone,
About a month ago, I got a funny situation where a cop made a u-turn to stop in a very showy fashion (that scared and surprised me) because he almost hit me while doing that.
Anyhow, he claimed that he metered me while he was driving towards me so he said his car is equipped to meter opposite coming cars as he drives. I filed the ticket and I was convicted within few days - an administrative error on part of the filing office. So, they fixed the issue and give me a court date only 5 months after I was issued the ticket which is sometime in Oct/Nov of 2011.
My questions are as follows:
1- Where and how can I apply to get the officer notes and gather all the information that is with the crown to fight this?
2- Are the police cars really equipped with radars to check speed of oncoming cars as they are driving themselves?
3- Since I don't think the timing is enough for me what can I do to postpone this to another time? I mean usually in Toronto it takes almost 2 years for your turn to come in court while this came in about 5 months time (I think only because of the administrative issue)
You need to request disclosure. Usually there is a form that you can send it, but procedure varies from one jurisdiction to the next. Contact the Court office to confirm. Yes, especially common in traffic units. They have "moving" radar, where there is a gun mounted on the dash and back window. It can determine the speed of approaching vehicles from either direction, or vehicles travelling in the same direction. It's able to determine the cruiser's speed, and then either adds/subtracts that from the target speed to determine your actual speed. It's been around for quite a while. You'd have to request an adjournment through the Court office. Just be aware, you'll have to justify your request, and I'm not sure how you'd argue 5 months isn't enough time to prepare for a pretty straightforward traffic ticket assuming disclosure is provided.
torontob wrote:
1- Where and how can I apply to get the officer notes and gather all the information that is with the crown to fight this?
You need to request disclosure. Usually there is a form that you can send it, but procedure varies from one jurisdiction to the next. Contact the Court office to confirm.
torontob wrote:
2- Are the police cars really equipped with radars to check speed of oncoming cars as they are driving themselves?
Yes, especially common in traffic units. They have "moving" radar, where there is a gun mounted on the dash and back window. It can determine the speed of approaching vehicles from either direction, or vehicles travelling in the same direction. It's able to determine the cruiser's speed, and then either adds/subtracts that from the target speed to determine your actual speed. It's been around for quite a while.
torontob wrote:
3- Since I don't think the timing is enough for me what can I do to postpone this to another time? I mean usually in Toronto it takes almost 2 years for your turn to come in court while this came in about 5 months time (I think only because of the administrative issue)
You'd have to request an adjournment through the Court office. Just be aware, you'll have to justify your request, and I'm not sure how you'd argue 5 months isn't enough time to prepare for a pretty straightforward traffic ticket assuming disclosure is provided.
Thanks for the info. Two more questions here: A- One thing that alerted me was that he said two other cops saw me going fast - well, why didn't they stop me? or why aren't they there as witness? Can I bring that up in court? B- Is disclosure something that can be posted to the Toronto court office? or do I have to drop by there? - I will in the meatime try to call them and ask this but I think there is a 50 minute wait on the phone. So, I appreciate it if someone can clarify that for Toronto court office for me. C- What if I miss the court date? I heard other people missed a court date and then went there and swore that they were out of town due to work or were sick and were given a chance to ask for another court date. If that is something that happens to me during that time what is the right process to follow? Thanks
Thanks for the info. Two more questions here:
A- One thing that alerted me was that he said two other cops saw me going fast - well, why didn't they stop me? or why aren't they there as witness? Can I bring that up in court?
B- Is disclosure something that can be posted to the Toronto court office? or do I have to drop by there? - I will in the meatime try to call them and ask this but I think there is a 50 minute wait on the phone. So, I appreciate it if someone can clarify that for Toronto court office for me.
C- What if I miss the court date? I heard other people missed a court date and then went there and swore that they were out of town due to work or were sick and were given a chance to ask for another court date. If that is something that happens to me during that time what is the right process to follow?
1) The other cruisers might not have radar, so called ahead to a unit that had radar 2) The other cruisers might not have been in an appropriate/safe location to make a uturn 3) The other cruisers might have been responding to a call for service, so called ahead to a unit that had radar
torontob wrote:
A- One thing that alerted me was that he said two other cops saw me going fast - well, why didn't they stop me?
1) The other cruisers might not have radar, so called ahead to a unit that had radar
2) The other cruisers might not have been in an appropriate/safe location to make a uturn
3) The other cruisers might have been responding to a call for service, so called ahead to a unit that had radar
Above is merely a suggestion/thought and in no way constitutes legal advice or views of my employer. www.OHTA.ca
Thanks for the clarification. However, I would mostly think that the other officers were in the coffee shop and just paged him and said, "Hey catch this guy..." which is really just eye sight and no metering and aren't both a condition of issuing a ticket? Isn't it a condition that a police must first see a car going fast, then prove that by pointing radar to the fast moving car? In this case he would have not had the chance to do that if I was in low grounds. Also anything for these questions: B- Is disclosure something that can be posted to the Toronto court office? or do I have to drop by there? - I will in the meatime try to call them and ask this but I think there is a 50 minute wait on the phone. So, I appreciate it if someone can clarify that for Toronto court office for me. C- What if I miss the court date? I heard other people missed a court date and then went there and swore that they were out of town due to work or were sick and were given a chance to ask for another court date. If that is something that happens to me during that time what is the right process to follow? Thanks again,
Thanks for the clarification.
However, I would mostly think that the other officers were in the coffee shop and just paged him and said, "Hey catch this guy..." which is really just eye sight and no metering and aren't both a condition of issuing a ticket?
Isn't it a condition that a police must first see a car going fast, then prove that by pointing radar to the fast moving car? In this case he would have not had the chance to do that if I was in low grounds.
Also anything for these questions:
B- Is disclosure something that can be posted to the Toronto court office? or do I have to drop by there? - I will in the meatime try to call them and ask this but I think there is a 50 minute wait on the phone. So, I appreciate it if someone can clarify that for Toronto court office for me.
C- What if I miss the court date? I heard other people missed a court date and then went there and swore that they were out of town due to work or were sick and were given a chance to ask for another court date. If that is something that happens to me during that time what is the right process to follow?
You can mail/fax/courier it to a court office, but usually the best method is to simply go there yourself and get your disclosure request stamped as proof that you did submit it. Bring one copy for them and one copy for yourself. If you miss the court date, you will be deemed not to dispute the charge and a conviction will be entered in your absence. Don't plan on missing it. You then have to provide a good reason to the JP as to why you missed the court date for them to strike out the conviction. A lot of them are not accepting work commitments as valid reasons for missing court, and for illness, you'll need a doctor's note of some sort. You'd have to file paperwork to get the case re-opened at the courthouse if you miss your court date.
You can mail/fax/courier it to a court office, but usually the best method is to simply go there yourself and get your disclosure request stamped as proof that you did submit it. Bring one copy for them and one copy for yourself.
If you miss the court date, you will be deemed not to dispute the charge and a conviction will be entered in your absence. Don't plan on missing it. You then have to provide a good reason to the JP as to why you missed the court date for them to strike out the conviction. A lot of them are not accepting work commitments as valid reasons for missing court, and for illness, you'll need a doctor's note of some sort. You'd have to file paperwork to get the case re-opened at the courthouse if you miss your court date.
* The above is NOT legal advice. By acting on anything I have said, you assume responsibility for any outcome and consequences. *
http://www.OntarioTicket.com OR http://www.OHTA.ca
I am curious what you are basing this on. Because you think something like this you need to prove it. You cannot make wild assumptions in court, well you can but most JP's will shut you down, ops
torontob wrote:
Thanks for the clarification.
However, I would mostly think that the other officers were in the coffee shop and just paged him and said, "Hey catch this guy..." which is really just eye sight and no metering and aren't both a condition of issuing a ticket?
Thanks again,
I am curious what you are basing this on. Because you think something like this you need to prove it. You cannot make wild assumptions in court, well you can but most JP's will shut you down,
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