Prosecutor appealing my dismissal

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Radar Identified
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by: Radar Identified on
Fri Jun 18, 2010 12:55 am

hwybear wrote:and yet just more BS and needless cutting of trees to throw another paper in a file so much for environmentally friendly!
same as putting in a "photocopy of the ticket" ...the defendant was given one and the original/legal one is sitting on the desk in front of the JP...so much for environmentally friendly!
Could easily save lots of trees and simplify disclosure process by:

- In addition to a "pay tickets" website, create a "fight tickets" website so paperwork only needs to be filed on-line
- Officer submits notes from tickets via scanning/email to Prosecutor's office so it can be readily retrieved
- When disclosure request comes in, Prosecutor clicks mouse a few times to retrieve notes, copy of manual, copy of ticket, bundled together as a disclosure packet electronically
- Prosecutor e-mails defendant PDF file of disclosure packet, or defendant can go to courthouse and print it off (e-mailed copy to defendant gets cc'd to court clerk's office as proof of delivery)

As for asking for disclosure of something the defendant already has (copy of ticket), I think you know where I stand on that.
'
We'll see what the outcome of this case is, although I would suspect it would be overturned. We'll see...
* The above is NOT legal advice. By acting on anything I have said, you assume responsibility for any outcome and consequences. *
http://www.OntarioTicket.com OR http://www.OHTA.ca


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hwybear
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by: hwybear on
Fri Jun 18, 2010 8:25 am

Great ideas....plus we jointly re-write the HTA to make sense
Radar Identified wrote:- In addition to a "pay tickets" website, create a "fight tickets" website so paperwork only needs to be filed on-line
Only point I disagree with is the above and it is not the ease of challenging the offence. There has to be some penalty, say $250-500 added to the fine for a "no show" at court. There are a lot that just mail in the trial notice and never show, wasting a lot of time, resources.

(IE: your website to challenge the offence notice
- choose the option 1 ,2 ,3
- if 3, next option return ask for disclosure, yes/no
- disclosure sent and have 30 days to respond, fail to respond and you are now deemed not to dispute.
- then 3 more choices:
1) pay the offence
2) resolve with prosecutor and book a resolution date. Disclaimer added that a $250 penalty will be imposed for a no show
3) trial, and book a court date. Disclaimer added that a $500 penalty will be imposed for a no show.
Above is merely a suggestion/thought and in no way constitutes legal advice or views of my employer. www.OHTA.ca


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Reflections
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by: Reflections on
Fri Jun 18, 2010 9:24 am

hwybear wrote:Great ideas....plus we jointly re-write the HTA to make sense
mdevo wrote:I originally decided to take this case on as a sort of science experiment, since I was curious how our justice system works.

1+1=2.

Bear, you wonder why there is so much time wasting/ no shows in traffic courts and we (the common folk) wonder why there is so much paperwork behind the process?

I think there should be manditory drivers ed and law classes in high school. Think that would clear up a lot of the "I didn't knows" and "WTF is this" we see now.
http://www.OHTA.ca OR http://www.OntarioTrafficAct.com


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by: Radar Identified on
Sat Jun 19, 2010 11:43 pm

hwybear wrote:plus we jointly re-write the HTA to make sense
One can only hope...
hwybear wrote:There has to be some penalty, say $250-500 added to the fine for a "no show" at court.
No argument there. No-show penalty should cover the cost of the officer's overtime, the Prosecutor's paperwork/filing, JP's time, etc. If there are extenuating circumstances (e.g. medical emergency), there could be exceptions granted on a case-by-case basis.

BTW, I like the "choose options" plus click for disclosure. Reduces paperwork and saves everyone time.
Reflections wrote:I think there should be manditory drivers ed and law classes in high school. Think that would clear up a lot of the "I didn't knows" and "WTF is this" we see now.
+1
* The above is NOT legal advice. By acting on anything I have said, you assume responsibility for any outcome and consequences. *
http://www.OntarioTicket.com OR http://www.OHTA.ca


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by: viper1 on
Sun Jun 20, 2010 12:47 pm

hwybear wrote:Great ideas....plus we jointly re-write the HTA to make sense
Radar Identified wrote:- In addition to a "pay tickets" website, create a "fight tickets" website so paperwork only needs to be filed on-line
Only point I disagree with is the above and it is not the ease of challenging the offence. There has to be some penalty, say $250-500 added to the fine for a "no show" at court. There are a lot that just mail in the trial notice and never show, wasting a lot of time, resources.

(IE: your website to challenge the offence notice
- choose the option 1 ,2 ,3
- if 3, next option return ask for disclosure, yes/no
- disclosure sent and have 30 days to respond, fail to respond and you are now deemed not to dispute.
- then 3 more choices:
1) pay the offence
2) resolve with prosecutor and book a resolution date. Disclaimer added that a $250 penalty will be imposed for a no show
3) trial, and book a court date. Disclaimer added that a $500 penalty will be imposed for a no show.
Of course to do that you must include a fine to the cop if they do not show.

Cheers
Viper1
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use at your own risk"


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by: mdevo on
Mon Jun 21, 2010 12:55 pm

With this type of appeal what costs are associated? I understand that if I loose I would have to pay for representation and the original ticket cost, but can there be other court imposed costs?

I'm trying to decide if it is worth while to take an offer from the prosecution, or continue with this appeal.


Thanks again.....

NOTE: Special thanks to BIRON for all the help provided.


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by: mathers on
Mon Jun 21, 2010 11:32 pm

I'd imagine the cost of the ticket and representation would be the bulk of it. I'd guess costs/court costs are tiny in comparison if levied at all. I wouldn't factor that into your decision.

What did the prosecution offer? It seems odd they would appeal and then offer you a deal where you just reverse your plea to guilty, as it would still effectively leave the points of law in the original decision not opposed.

Did you get the transcript and the crown's appeal factum? Have you hired a paralegal/lawyer? IMHO, you've gone this far - if your agent can articulate a reasonable reply to the appeal factum and thinks you might be able to get the decision held, take one for the team and keep going!

Were you able to show through cross-examination that the officer's level of knowledge on how to operate the device suffered due to a lack of training/qualifications, or was it strictly a non-disclosure issue?


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by: mdevo on
Tue Jun 22, 2010 11:03 am

What did the prosecution offer?


Reduced to no points....
Did you get the transcript and the crown's appeal factum?
YES..........
Have you hired a paralegal/lawyer?


Have recieved help from Biron.........
Were you able to show through cross-examination that the officer's level of knowledge on how to operate the device suffered due to a lack of training/qualifications, or was it strictly a non-disclosure issue?
Non disclosure, nothing was provided to show he was qualified.

I will continue if there is a glimmer of hope..............just trying to get that feeling, but my time is running out!

mdevo


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by: mdevo on
Wed Jun 23, 2010 5:36 pm

FYI
I decided to take the advise & ammended ticket (from 134/100 to 115/100 ) "Biron" arranged for me with the prosecution instead of responding to the appeal. Being certin about the outcome, has relieved the burden.

I have to say thank you to all on this forum for their information and opinion. That knowledge got me this far and allowed me to experience the court system first hand.

Allthough I am relieved, I do feel dissapointment of not seeing this thru to the end.

This time I felt as if luck was not on my side.....................

Cheers


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