I searched but could not retrieve a satisfactory answer. It seems matter-of-fact that all sorts of work equipment, namely backhoes, loaders and other similar mororized vehicles without licence plates, sometimes equipped with a slow moving vehicle sign, often not, some with an amber beacon, some without, are encountered on a highway, travelling under their own power, sometimes on multi-lane roads and often for considerable distances. I was under the impression that these vehicles are not licenced to be on a highway and have to be trailered between work sites. Am I wrong?? I see many close calls with these slow moving, mobile traffic jams and wonder why this seems to be acceptable, yet an ATV or similar vehicle generally has to stay off the highway. Insights?
I searched but could not retrieve a satisfactory answer.
It seems matter-of-fact that all sorts of work equipment, namely backhoes, loaders and other similar mororized vehicles without licence plates, sometimes equipped with a slow moving vehicle sign, often not, some with an amber beacon, some without, are encountered on a highway, travelling under their own power, sometimes on multi-lane roads and often for considerable distances.
I was under the impression that these vehicles are not licenced to be on a highway and have to be trailered between work sites. Am I wrong??
I see many close calls with these slow moving, mobile traffic jams and wonder why this seems to be acceptable, yet an ATV or similar vehicle generally has to stay off the highway.
They are classified as "work Equipment", and so far as I know, (for sure my company) you must have a permit to operate them on roadways etc... By permit I mean not a plate, but permission.
They are classified as "work Equipment", and so far as I know, (for sure my company) you must have a permit to operate them on roadways etc...
By permit I mean not a plate, but permission.
Science will fly you to the moon, religion will fly you into buildings.
You would rather have a truck come along to move them 1/2 mile or less?(imagine that traffic mess) How would you build the road without these vehicles? That said there should be a flag-person or blinking lights when moving. Cheers Viper1
cattlerepairman wrote:
I searched but could not retrieve a satisfactory answer.
It seems matter-of-fact that all sorts of work equipment, namely backhoes, loaders and other similar mororized vehicles without licence plates, sometimes equipped with a slow moving vehicle sign, often not, some with an amber beacon, some without, are encountered on a highway, travelling under their own power, sometimes on multi-lane roads and often for considerable distances.
I was under the impression that these vehicles are not licenced to be on a highway and have to be trailered between work sites. Am I wrong??
I see many close calls with these slow moving, mobile traffic jams and wonder why this seems to be acceptable, yet an ATV or similar vehicle generally has to stay off the highway.
Insights?
You would rather have a truck come along to move them 1/2 mile or less?(imagine that traffic mess)
How would you build the road without these vehicles?
That said there should be a flag-person or blinking lights when moving.
Cheers
Viper1
"hang onto your chair when reading my posts
use at your own risk"
My question is not meant to offend the construction industry. If there is indeed a "permit" of some sort, what is it based on? How are these vehicles insured for on-road use? Are they subject to a safety and emissions inspection, similar to other vehicles that use highways? Clearly, many of these vehicles are not built for road use (lack of suspension, slow speed, not all wheels braked, operator safety devices, protruding parts etc.). I just want to have some information that dispells my impression that authorities simply permit a double-standard for on-road use without any basis in the HTA whatsoever. If the above observations do not matter, then we should not need any registration/plates/insurance for similar vehicles that are slow and do not fulfill the same technical standards as a modern vehicle (historic vehicles, such as a Ford Model T, for example) and we should be ok using ATVs on the highway for short distances as well ("imagine the effort if we had to trailer these", just to use a previous poster's argument). I understand the need for these vehicles to get from one work site to another and the clear need for some to work on the road (a grader or loader for snow removal, for example). I am still not convinced that "because" is a sufficient argument to drive them on a highway in a non-working capacity for pure relocation. The same right should then be extended to other vehicles or other people. Why can the loader move under the above provisions, but one has to pay dear money to get the same privilege for the dump truck? I re-iterate my original question: Where in the HTA is the basis for such vehicles not registered for road use to use a public highway?
My question is not meant to offend the construction industry.
If there is indeed a "permit" of some sort, what is it based on? How are these vehicles insured for on-road use? Are they subject to a safety and emissions inspection, similar to other vehicles that use highways?
Clearly, many of these vehicles are not built for road use (lack of suspension, slow speed, not all wheels braked, operator safety devices, protruding parts etc.).
I just want to have some information that dispells my impression that authorities simply permit a double-standard for on-road use without any basis in the HTA whatsoever.
If the above observations do not matter, then we should not need any registration/plates/insurance for similar vehicles that are slow and do not fulfill the same technical standards as a modern vehicle (historic vehicles, such as a Ford Model T, for example) and we should be ok using ATVs on the highway for short distances as well ("imagine the effort if we had to trailer these", just to use a previous poster's argument).
I understand the need for these vehicles to get from one work site to another and the clear need for some to work on the road (a grader or loader for snow removal, for example). I am still not convinced that "because" is a sufficient argument to drive them on a highway in a non-working capacity for pure relocation. The same right should then be extended to other vehicles or other people. Why can the loader move under the above provisions, but one has to pay dear money to get the same privilege for the dump truck?
I re-iterate my original question: Where in the HTA is the basis for such vehicles not registered for road use to use a public highway?
HTA Definitions Sec 1 "road-building machine" means a self-propelled vehicle of a design commonly used in the construction or maintenance of highways, including but not limited to, (a) asphalt spreaders, concrete paving or finishing machines, motor graders, rollers, tractor-dozers and motor scrapers, (b) tracked and wheeled tractors of all kinds while equipped with mowers, post-hole diggers, compactors, weed spraying equipment, snow blowers and snow plows, front-end loaders, back-hoes or rock drills, and (c) power shovels on tracks and drag lines on tracks, but not including a commercial motor vehicle; "commercial motor vehicle" means a motor vehicle having permanently attached thereto a truck or delivery body and includes ambulances, hearses, casket wagons, fire apparatus, buses and tractors used for hauling purposes on the highways "motor vehicle" includes an automobile, a motorcycle, a motor-assisted bicycle unless otherwise indicated in this Act, and any other vehicle propelled or driven otherwise than by muscular power, but DOES NOT include a street car or other motor vehicle running only upon rails, a power-assisted bicycle, a motorized snow vehicle, a traction engine, a farm tractor, a self-propelled implement of husbandry or a road-building machine Permit requirements 7. (1) No person shall drive a motor vehicle on a highway unless, (a) there exists a currently validated permit for the vehicle; (b) there are displayed on the vehicle, in the prescribed manner, (i) number plates
HTA Definitions Sec 1
"road-building machine" means a self-propelled vehicle of a design commonly used in the construction or maintenance of highways, including but not limited to,
(a) asphalt spreaders, concrete paving or finishing machines, motor graders, rollers, tractor-dozers and motor scrapers,
(b) tracked and wheeled tractors of all kinds while equipped with mowers, post-hole diggers, compactors, weed spraying equipment, snow blowers and snow plows, front-end loaders, back-hoes or rock drills, and
(c) power shovels on tracks and drag lines on tracks,
but not including a commercial motor vehicle;
"commercial motor vehicle" means a motor vehicle having permanently attached thereto a truck or delivery body and includes ambulances, hearses, casket wagons, fire apparatus, buses and tractors used for hauling purposes on the highways
"motor vehicle" includes an automobile, a motorcycle, a motor-assisted bicycle unless otherwise indicated in this Act, and any other vehicle propelled or driven otherwise than by muscular power,
but DOES NOT include a street car or other motor vehicle running only upon rails, a power-assisted bicycle, a motorized snow vehicle, a traction engine, a farm tractor, a self-propelled implement of husbandry or a road-building machine
Permit requirements
7. (1) No person shall drive a motor vehicle on a highway unless,
(a) there exists a currently validated permit for the vehicle;
(b) there are displayed on the vehicle, in the prescribed manner,
(i) number plates
Above is merely a suggestion/thought and in no way constitutes legal advice or views of my employer. www.OHTA.ca
Hwybear, thank you. So, what you posted means that a road building machine is a motor vehicle under the HTA and therefore has to have a permit and display license plates in order to travel on a highway. I have yet to see one that does.
Hwybear, thank you. So, what you posted means that a road building machine is a motor vehicle under the HTA and therefore has to have a permit and display license plates in order to travel on a highway.
That is not correct. I will break out the definition a little bit here.... "motor vehicle" INCLUDES -an automobile, - a motorcycle, - a motor-assisted bicycle unless otherwise indicated in this Act and - any other vehicle propelled or driven otherwise than by muscular power (ie ATV, golf carts etc) but DOES NOT include - a street car or - other motor vehicle running only upon rails, - a power-assisted bicycle, - a motorized snow vehicle, - a traction engine, a farm tractor, - a self-propelled implement of husbandry or - a road-building machine
cattlerepairman wrote:
Hwybear, thank you. So, what you posted means that a road building machine is a motor vehicle under the HTA and therefore has to have a permit and display license plates in order to travel on a highway.
.
That is not correct. I will break out the definition a little bit here....
"motor vehicle"
INCLUDES
-an automobile,
- a motorcycle,
- a motor-assisted bicycle unless otherwise indicated in this Act and
- any other vehicle propelled or driven otherwise than by muscular power (ie ATV, golf carts etc)
but DOES NOT include
- a street car or
- other motor vehicle running only upon rails,
- a power-assisted bicycle,
- a motorized snow vehicle,
- a traction engine, a farm tractor,
- a self-propelled implement of husbandry or
- a road-building machine
Above is merely a suggestion/thought and in no way constitutes legal advice or views of my employer. www.OHTA.ca
so if i understand if i have a snow plow mounted and am moving from site to site i can now drive my atv on the road. have heard lots of back and forth on this one and no one can come up with a 100 % answer. i use my atv for driveways and sidewalks so one would think with amber lights and what you said this is ok ?
so if i understand if i have a snow plow mounted and am moving from site to site i can now drive my atv on the road. have heard lots of back and forth on this one and no one can come up with a 100 % answer. i use my atv for driveways and sidewalks so one would think with amber lights and what you said this is ok ?
An ATV with a snow plow attached to the front doesn't become any more of a "snow plow vehicle" for the purpose of the HTA than does a pickup truck with a plow on the front. You would drive your pickup truck on the road uninsured and unplated just because it has a plow on it, would you? "Snow plow" in the HTA is meant to refer to those purpose build machines driven around by guys who work for the city.
An ATV with a snow plow attached to the front doesn't become any more of a "snow plow vehicle" for the purpose of the HTA than does a pickup truck with a plow on the front. You would drive your pickup truck on the road uninsured and unplated just because it has a plow on it, would you? "Snow plow" in the HTA is meant to refer to those purpose build machines driven around by guys who work for the city.
Simon, if this is indeed so, it re-opens my original question about backhoes. If the interpretation of the vehicle categories for the purpose of the HTA is indeed as narrow as you indicate for snow plow vehicles (meaning: a purpose-built plow used by a municipality or similar, not a privately owned pickup with a plow or an ATV with a plow), logic would suggest that the same principle be applied for road-building vehicle (then meaning a vehicle actually being used to build a road, not just any Dick, Tom or Harry that has a backhoe for foundation excavation, septic systems or general construction work and trundles along between job sites).
Simon Borys wrote:
An ATV with a snow plow attached to the front doesn't become any more of a "snow plow vehicle" for the purpose of the HTA than does a pickup truck with a plow on the front. You would drive your pickup truck on the road uninsured and unplated just because it has a plow on it, would you? "Snow plow" in the HTA is meant to refer to those purpose build machines driven around by guys who work for the city.
Simon, if this is indeed so, it re-opens my original question about backhoes. If the interpretation of the vehicle categories for the purpose of the HTA is indeed as narrow as you indicate for snow plow vehicles (meaning: a purpose-built plow used by a municipality or similar, not a privately owned pickup with a plow or an ATV with a plow), logic would suggest that the same principle be applied for road-building vehicle (then meaning a vehicle actually being used to build a road, not just any Dick, Tom or Harry that has a backhoe for foundation excavation, septic systems or general construction work and trundles along between job sites).
I think that the pickup or ATV with the snow plow doesn't count as a "snow plow" because it's first and foremost a pickup or an ATV and thus should be licenced like that. Backhoes or whatnot are simply what they are, and I don't think it matters if it's being used in a professional or amateur capacity, since these vehicles are not really anything other than what they are (i.e. a machine for digging, etc). With respect to the slow moving vehicle sign question, remember that section applies to "vehicles", not just "motor vehicles. Street cars, other motor vehicles running only upon rails, power-assisted bicycles, motorized snow vehicles, traction engines, farm tractors, self-propelled implements of husbandry, and road-building machines are not "motor vehicles" but they do meet the definition of "vehicle" under the HTA so slow moving vehicle sign requirements do apply to them.
I think that the pickup or ATV with the snow plow doesn't count as a "snow plow" because it's first and foremost a pickup or an ATV and thus should be licenced like that. Backhoes or whatnot are simply what they are, and I don't think it matters if it's being used in a professional or amateur capacity, since these vehicles are not really anything other than what they are (i.e. a machine for digging, etc).
With respect to the slow moving vehicle sign question, remember that section applies to "vehicles", not just "motor vehicles. Street cars, other motor vehicles running only upon rails, power-assisted bicycles, motorized snow vehicles, traction engines, farm tractors, self-propelled implements of husbandry, and road-building machines are not "motor vehicles" but they do meet the definition of "vehicle" under the HTA so slow moving vehicle sign requirements do apply to them.
Simply a truck and plow must be properly licenced to be on any highway as it is defined a motor vehicle. Use of flashing blue lights is also prohibited on private snow removal equipment. A backhoe is by definition a roadbuilding machine An ATV is defined as a Off-Road Vehicle and can not be on any highway (all area between property lines- ditch, shoulder, sidewalk, roadway) unless - drive directly across a highway - farmer using it for agricultural purposes with a slow moving vehicle sign - licenced trapper with a slow moving vehicle sign - highway is designated by Provincial government (northern ontario) - highway is designated thru a Municipal bylaw for ATV use Slow Moving Vehicle Sign - Slow moving vehicles HTA 76 (2) The following are slow moving vehicles: 1. Farm tractors and self-propelled implements of husbandry. 2. Vehicles (other than bicycles, motor assisted bicycles and disabled motor vehicles in tow) that are not capable of attaining and sustaining a speed greater than 40 kilometres per hour on level ground when operated on a highway. 3. Motor vehicles towing an implement of husbandry
Simply a truck and plow must be properly licenced to be on any highway as it is defined a motor vehicle. Use of flashing blue lights is also prohibited on private snow removal equipment.
A backhoe is by definition a roadbuilding machine
An ATV is defined as a Off-Road Vehicle and can not be on any highway (all area between property lines- ditch, shoulder, sidewalk, roadway) unless
- drive directly across a highway
- farmer using it for agricultural purposes with a slow moving vehicle sign
- licenced trapper with a slow moving vehicle sign
- highway is designated by Provincial government (northern ontario)
- highway is designated thru a Municipal bylaw for ATV use
Slow Moving Vehicle Sign - Slow moving vehicles
HTA 76
(2) The following are slow moving vehicles:
1. Farm tractors and self-propelled implements of husbandry.
2. Vehicles (other than bicycles, motor assisted bicycles and disabled motor vehicles in tow) that are not capable of attaining and sustaining a speed greater than 40 kilometres per hour on level ground when operated on a highway.
3. Motor vehicles towing an implement of husbandry
Above is merely a suggestion/thought and in no way constitutes legal advice or views of my employer. www.OHTA.ca
so now by what you say hwybear by def. of HTA a side x side is not classed as an Off-Road Vehicle due to lack of handel bars and a seat like a car so joe blow can have a bobcat skid steer witch is harder on the road surface and is ok but jim blow cant due the excact same thing ( i will give u the atv thing because it is defined in the HTA but side x sides are NOT atvs under HTA) not trying to give any one a hard time just my 2 cents and yes blue lights have never bean aloud on personal or privet plows on the roads unless under contract by town or city
so now by what you say hwybear by def. of HTA a side x side is not classed as an Off-Road Vehicle due to lack of handel bars and a seat like a car so joe blow can have a bobcat skid steer witch is harder on the road surface and is ok but jim blow cant due the excact same thing ( i will give u the atv thing because it is defined in the HTA but side x sides are NOT atvs under HTA) not trying to give any one a hard time just my 2 cents and yes blue lights have never bean aloud on personal or privet plows on the roads unless under contract by town or city
off-road vehicle" means a vehicle propelled or driven otherwise than by muscular power or wind and designed to travel, (a) on not more than three wheels, or (b) on more than three wheels and being of a prescribed class of vehicle the following classes of vehicles are prescribed: 1. Dune buggies. 1.1 Vehicles designed for use on all terrains, commonly known as all-terrain vehicles, that have steering handlebars and a seat that is designed to be straddled by the driver. 1.2 Vehicles designed for utility applications or uses on all terrains that have four or more wheels and a seat that is not designed to be straddled by the driver. *********************** Both the HTA (larger penalties) or ORVA can be used for enforcement on highways
off-road vehicle" means a vehicle propelled or driven otherwise than by muscular power or wind and designed to travel,
(a) on not more than three wheels, or
(b) on more than three wheels and being of a prescribed class of vehicle
the following classes of vehicles are prescribed:
1. Dune buggies.
1.1 Vehicles designed for use on all terrains, commonly known as all-terrain vehicles, that have steering handlebars and a seat that is designed to be straddled by the driver.
1.2 Vehicles designed for utility applications or uses on all terrains that have four or more wheels and a seat that is not designed to be straddled by the driver.
***********************
Both the HTA (larger penalties) or ORVA can be used for enforcement on highways
Above is merely a suggestion/thought and in no way constitutes legal advice or views of my employer. www.OHTA.ca
So do these 'road building machines' need plates or a permit or both? and where do you go or what do you have to do to get them? I guess I still don't get this?
So do these 'road building machines' need plates or a permit or both?
and where do you go or what do you have to do to get them?
I will be going to trial for my red light camera offence.
I'll be arguing two issues, centered on the fact that there are two essential elements of 144(18) - a) a vehicle approaching the intersection shall stop; and b) the vehicle shall not proceed until green. Both essential elements must be contravened beyond a reasonable doubt to be an offence.
1) My ticket says I (being the owner) am "charged…
I know that the RIDE program has been covered extensively in these great forums, but I have a question about the stop itself:
I recently was stopped for a RIDE Program and the officer asked me to roll the window down all of the way (I had it at half and could easily communicate with them). I told them that I could hear them just fine and they insisted I roll it down all of the way. Again I told…
Not sure the right place for this so if it needs to be moved please do so.
I was stopped today for 15 over the speed limit, I gave all the documents to the officer and he said he could not accept a photocopy of my ownership only the original I had a photo copy front and back and I had my plate sticker number with it.
he gave me a ticket for HWY ACT Section 7(5)(a) he said only the original would…
Hey! I'm from Sudbury Ontario. Hope that general talk is fine for this subject
I am very serious about looking for exact ruling about underfacing lighting
Section 14 clearly states:
Red and blue lights to the front restricted
(14.1) In addition to the lighting requirements in this Part, a police department vehicle may carry lamps that cast red and blue lights, but no other motor vehicle shall carry…
i was driving my dad's car when i was caught by the red light camera in Brampton. My dad would've to take time off work to go ask for a trial and then go to one.
Can i represent him? if yes, what do i need to do?
I was pulled over and told I went through a red light during a right turn. I learned through a friend who is a police constable that the one who pulled me over is new to the job (under a year, and possibly even the first month or two of real duty).
I was given a ticket for $180. I have some questions:
(1) Is this offense automatically associated with 3 demerit points? I see no mention of them on…
I got a ticket for 'Disobey Stop Sign' in November of 2013 (in York Region), requested disclosure and went to court in August of 2014. At my first appearance, I did not plea but requested an ajournment to to consult legal advice. The JOP set the next appearance in September.
I contacted a paralegal about my options. He told me that on my next appearance, if the police officer did not show, the…
I had a trial and found guilty, but the trial seemed to go wrong since the beginning.
The JP asked me if i am intending to take the stand- I said NO.
I asked how to submit my evidence-documents and photos.
JP said-i have to take the stand if i want to submit evidence.(Now i am finding this is wrong-i could introduce my evidence during cross examination and my defense would be much stronger)
Ottawa, Canada (AHN) - Beginning Tuesday, or April Fool's Day 2008, fines on Quebec drivers caught overspeeding will be doubled. It is not only the money penalty that will go up, but also demerit points.
The new law, Bill 42, is similar to Ontario's street racing rule. It stipulates fines for motorists who drive at over 40 km/h at under 60 km/h zones, speed at 50 km/h at 60 to 90 km/h areas and…
Make big trucks go slower and the roads will become safer.
Obvious, isn't it? It's also obvious when you look out the window that the world is flat.
Last Monday, truckers in Ontario tried to mount a convoy to Queen's Park to show their opposition to electronic speed limiters. These devices, electronic chips in trucks' engine management systems, restrict speeds…
I was out on a four lane highway around Orangeville Ontario and I noticed a school bus coming south (I was going north). I kept my eyes on the bus in case it was going to stop. As I approached it, it was slowing down a little, but no lights, and especially no arm with the STOP sign. As I was just about to pass the bus, I still did not see the lights, nor did I see the STOP sign.
Hey everyone first off I'd like to say great website, I have been reading and it is very useful
I'm posting today as I'd like to get some feedback on my situation and have a couple of questions. Please excuse the vagueness in some areas - I don't want my case to be identifiable given the small town.
So I was driving up north and was pulled over by an OPP SUV for doing 31 over. Cop drove past me,…
Driving on a 80km/hr highway the car ahead hits the brakes and slows to 55, l slow down right behind him no reason to slow down traffic was moving between 80 and 90. I notice the driver is on the phone and looking through papers on the passenger seat. He begins to start to go a opp officer drives by doing 80 plus in oncoming lane turns around and says l was following to close. Told him what was…
My son was making a right turn at the intersection he had a green so slowed down looked and proceeded into the turn. It was pouring rain and the was a big pool of water as he got arround the curb. He tried to keep the car going sharp right however it slid into the car making a left turn. the lane he was turning into is very narrow and at a very busy corner. He paniced and left the scene only…
I had an collision the other day. I was turing left and ran into a car going straight in the opposite direction. The insurance company has already determined that I'm at fault, since I made the left turn. But I'm wondering whether I should go on trail and at least I might get rid of the ticket. The ticket was under 142(1)
I was told that if I go on court, both the guy I hit and the officer who…
question for a friend of mine.....says she got a 3 day suspension for giving a A on a roadside. Thing is she wasnt driving. She is a g2 driver and the car was parked in a parking lot, she just ran out to get something and turned the car on. Can a 3 day be issued if you arent driving on a highway - (I've read for impaired it doesnt matter, but 3 day isnt criminal)? And is there any way to…
I can't find the category for this post so I'm posting it here.
Two questions...
1. Are golf carts considered a 'vehicle' under the Highway traffic act? I know carts can't drive across roads or on roads but if you try to bring one from the USA into Canada they are considered a 'vehicle'.
2. If you are on private property are you allowed to carry 'opened' alcohol in your golf cart? I know golf…
I got pulled over (along with about 10 other cars) for going through a road closed sign. I had just pulled out of a parking lot pretty much right beside the road closed sign, and with about 4 cars behind me there wasn't much I could do but go through, so I think I have a good chance of fighting it. However, on my ticket under the Signature of issuing Provincial Offences Officer, it's left…
I was driving westbound on Hwy. 8 earlier this month in North Dumfries Township, approaching the Cambridge city limits. The weather was clear and the roads were dry. I noticed a vehicle on the shoulder on my side of the road, pointing towards me. This didn't concern me right away, as it is a rural area and I sometimes see vehicles doing mail delivery. The vehicle then started accelerating and…
I was pulled over yesterday in a community safety zone and told I was doing 84 in a 50. When i passed the officer I looked at my odometer and I was only doing 64. I was given a summons on the spot to appear in court at the end of June. Do I have any chance in this if it comes down to his word over mine. I was in the car alone but have travelled these same roads every day, twice a day for 6 years…
who is at fault when :a) a passenger opens door and jumps out of vehicle onto the road with traffic. b) he gets hit by a car travelling in the adjoining lane. c) traffic lights were green. d) pedestrian crossing was further up and indicated "no crossing" light e) the vehicle that he exited from leaves the scene as soon as accident occurred. f) no charges have been laid after police filed report…
