Hello, I was recently pulled over by an OPP police officer on my way home from Gananoque to Kingston when I was about to enter the 401. He asked me if I had anything to drink and I told him I didnt. After that things went for the worse. He then told me to open my car door, which surprised me because he had absolutely no reason to search my vehicle since I wasn't suspected of committing any crime. I decided to do so because he was visibly angry and intimidating and did not want to have an altercation with him. When I opened the door he saw my brother and father sitting on the back seats without their seatbelts and proceeded to confiscate their drivers license and write them a ticket. I told him later on that I knew he had violated my rights to unreasonable search and seizure under the Canadian Charter of Rights and Freedoms. From what I understand, a police officer cannot stop you and search your vehicle unless he has reasonable suspicion that you committed a crime, which he certainly did not. I also am aware that you cannot stop a motorist to check if they are wearing their seatbelt because that is a violation of the purpose of the Highway Traffic Act. He also misrepresented the reason for stopping me by first claiming it was for a DUI check-up and then proceeding to search my car as if I was a criminal without reasonable cause to do so. In the end, he wrote a ticket under the Highway Traffic Act for driving without a seatbelt even though he had no evidence since he never caught us in the act and ordered us against our will to open the car door without reasonable cause. My brother and father had their seatbelts off AFTER he stopped the car and told them to open the door so he never could prove that they were without their seatbelts while driving. I did not want to comply with his unlawful order but felt that it could have escalated into something worse. I just wanted to know if anyone could tell me whether I could potentially have a case to defend my family in court and waive the penalty fee. I could use some advice on this.
Hello,
I was recently pulled over by an OPP police officer on my way home from Gananoque to Kingston when I was about to enter the 401. He asked me if I had anything to drink and I told him I didnt. After that things went for the worse. He then told me to open my car door, which surprised me because he had absolutely no reason to search my vehicle since I wasn't suspected of committing any crime. I decided to do so because he was visibly angry and intimidating and did not want to have an altercation with him. When I opened the door he saw my brother and father sitting on the back seats without their seatbelts and proceeded to confiscate their drivers license and write them a ticket. I told him later on that I knew he had violated my rights to unreasonable search and seizure under the Canadian Charter of Rights and Freedoms. From what I understand, a police officer cannot stop you and search your vehicle unless he has reasonable suspicion that you committed a crime, which he certainly did not. I also am aware that you cannot stop a motorist to check if they are wearing their seatbelt because that is a violation of the purpose of the Highway Traffic Act. He also misrepresented the reason for stopping me by first claiming it was for a DUI check-up and then proceeding to search my car as if I was a criminal without reasonable cause to do so. In the end, he wrote a ticket under the Highway Traffic Act for driving without a seatbelt even though he had no evidence since he never caught us in the act and ordered us against our will to open the car door without reasonable cause. My brother and father had their seatbelts off AFTER he stopped the car and told them to open the door so he never could prove that they were without their seatbelts while driving. I did not want to comply with his unlawful order but felt that it could have escalated into something worse. I just wanted to know if anyone could tell me whether I could potentially have a case to defend my family in court and waive the penalty fee. I could use some advice on this.
Your understanding of police authority is fundamentally wrong. If you are stopped at a RIDE check (which is the way it sounds), the police are following the accepted brief detention and violation of your Charter rights. If the same police observe an offence being committed as a result of that interaction you seem to believe they should be obligated to ignore it. Having someone open their car door is acceptable to facilitate an interaction with them. It happens all the time at ride checks because windows wont lower. I would suggest that your passengers contact legal representation if they choose to fight the charges.
Your understanding of police authority is fundamentally wrong. If you are stopped at a RIDE check (which is the way it sounds), the police are following the accepted brief detention and violation of your Charter rights. If the same police observe an offence being committed as a result of that interaction you seem to believe they should be obligated to ignore it.
Having someone open their car door is acceptable to facilitate an interaction with them. It happens all the time at ride checks because windows wont lower.
I would suggest that your passengers contact legal representation if they choose to fight the charges.
The windows were tinted in the back, there is no way he could have seen my father and brother without their seatbelts on or even partially. And if he's claiming its for the RIDE program than why do my passangers in the vehicle have to be involved? Isn't this program supposed to be about protecting citizens from drunk driving? Its funny how he claims its for DUI and then decides to order me to open my car door and writes tickets for seatbelts. Im certain this officer was overstepping the boundaries of what a DUI stop is all about otherwise he would have left after I told him I didn't have anything to drink.
The windows were tinted in the back, there is no way he could have seen my father and brother without their seatbelts on or even partially. And if he's claiming its for the RIDE program than why do my passangers in the vehicle have to be involved? Isn't this program supposed to be about protecting citizens from drunk driving? Its funny how he claims its for DUI and then decides to order me to open my car door and writes tickets for seatbelts. Im certain this officer was overstepping the boundaries of what a DUI stop is all about otherwise he would have left after I told him I didn't have anything to drink.
Probably a good idea to request disclosure to see what the officers evidence is and stated reason(s) for pulling you over. Personally I think the simplest defence would be to argue that the officers observations were made at a time when your vehicle was parked. There would need to be some evidence supporting your passengers being unbelted at a time when the vehicle was in motion or operation. A Charter defence is a bit more of an arduous undertaking, and Im not sure if you have enough for one. Random stops are allowed under the Highway Traffic Act, something the Supreme Court has upheld (barely). While random stops may be a charter violation, its considered brief and minor and allowed under section 1 of the Charter which allows for "reasonable limits" to any rights in a free and democratic society. So the question is does asking someone step out of the vehicle overstep these limits? That Im not sure of. Id think simply asking someone to step out of their vehicle does not necessarily qualify as a search in itself. There are valid reasons in my opinion why an officer could do so without triggering a charter violation. Again though Id stress that Charter arguments are not straightforward and legal representation might be a good idea if thats how you (or your passengers) want to proceed. Thats why Id try and proceed on what I think would be a simpler defence strategy (no evidence to support the offence) versus a Charter argument.
Probably a good idea to request disclosure to see what the officers evidence is and stated reason(s) for pulling you over.
Personally I think the simplest defence would be to argue that the officers observations were made at a time when your vehicle was parked. There would need to be some evidence supporting your passengers being unbelted at a time when the vehicle was in motion or operation.
A Charter defence is a bit more of an arduous undertaking, and Im not sure if you have enough for one. Random stops are allowed under the Highway Traffic Act, something the Supreme Court has upheld (barely). While random stops may be a charter violation, its considered brief and minor and allowed under section 1 of the Charter which allows for "reasonable limits" to any rights in a free and democratic society.
So the question is does asking someone step out of the vehicle overstep these limits? That Im not sure of. Id think simply asking someone to step out of their vehicle does not necessarily qualify as a search in itself. There are valid reasons in my opinion why an officer could do so without triggering a charter violation.
Again though Id stress that Charter arguments are not straightforward and legal representation might be a good idea if thats how you (or your passengers) want to proceed. Thats why Id try and proceed on what I think would be a simpler defence strategy (no evidence to support the offence) versus a Charter argument.
Actually you have no standing to argue that your rights were violated on your friend's tickets. That's not the way it works. Now they can argue a lot of the same issues, but it has to be from their perspective. As has been said, the stop is probably not the problem here, because of the general HTA authority & supporting case law which approves this as a limited and acceptable detention. The issue seems to be a s. 8 one - that the officer conducted a warrantless (visual) search of the vehicle after telling you to open the door. This could be distinguished from looking through open or clear windows if he couldn't see in the back without opening the door. It could also be distinguished from the situation of needing to open the door to conduct the sobriety check because the windows won't open. That being said there are cases I am aware of that go the other way and say that the opening of the door is not a s. 8 breach. And then you have to consider what remedy you would be asking for under 24(2). What evidence is it that you want excluded? This is why, as people have said, Charter arguments are not simple.
Actually you have no standing to argue that your rights were violated on your friend's tickets. That's not the way it works. Now they can argue a lot of the same issues, but it has to be from their perspective.
As has been said, the stop is probably not the problem here, because of the general HTA authority & supporting case law which approves this as a limited and acceptable detention.
The issue seems to be a s. 8 one - that the officer conducted a warrantless (visual) search of the vehicle after telling you to open the door. This could be distinguished from looking through open or clear windows if he couldn't see in the back without opening the door. It could also be distinguished from the situation of needing to open the door to conduct the sobriety check because the windows won't open.
That being said there are cases I am aware of that go the other way and say that the opening of the door is not a s. 8 breach.
And then you have to consider what remedy you would be asking for under 24(2). What evidence is it that you want excluded?
This is why, as people have said, Charter arguments are not simple.
I got ticket for failing to stop at stop sign in Toronto. i heard that the police officer must see the stop line, if there is one, from where he was sitting. That is exactly my case, Is it a strong case? If so do i need a picture to show that there is a stop line and a picture to show that he could not see the stop line from where he was sitting?
I got a ticket, Disobey stop sign, sec 136.1.a on dec 6th
I made a left in an intersection and was pulled over by a police officer in an unmarked car who had been sitting down the road. A classic fishing hole situation. I was genuinely surprised when he stopped me and told me I went through a stop sign without even slowing down. I know to shut up and be polite and take the ticket. I…
Yesterday morning, I rear-ended someone. I was going the speed limit. The sun was directly in front of me and it blinded my windshield and my eyes. At the same time, the person in front of me stopped/slowed down (also due to the sun). I started to slow down but didn't stop and I hit them since I couldn't see anything. I was not driving too close initially. I…
I was driving in the county at night and hit a limousine stretched out side ways across the road. The limo had its lights on and had side lighting as well. The police officer charged me with careless driving because it was "fully lit up".
It took me to the next day to figure out what had happened - what I remember made no sense. What I had run across was a "false visual reference" illusion.
I was on hwy 37 trying to make my girlfriends ganadmas mass and I live an hour away and I had an hour to get there so I was going fast but not 50 over untill some idiot got on my tail soo close that I was to concentrated on him that I kept going faster untill I got pulled over at 147 on an 80 km hwy.
I alreaddy lost 3 points and this time was just the…
Hello, got stopped today for rolling a stop sign. Ticket says failure to stop, but quotes hta 1361b.
Doesn't 1361b mean failure to yield?
Is this a fatal error? Or could it be amended at trial. How can I prepare a defence if I don't know if I'm defending the failure to stop or the failure to yield?
After he was providing me with a ticket for failure to obey to the stop sign (I am pretty sure I stopped but less than 3 seconds recommended by my driver ed. instructor), I know everybody say that..as an excuse.
Then he stopped me again to return the documents.
Any advice and feed back would be really appreciated.
Can you get evidence for whether someone had an advanced green at an intersection? My dad was making a right turn on a red (after stopping) into a plaza parking lot. He got hit by someone making a left turn from the opposite lane. The driver told the officer called to the collision that he had an advance green. My dad said he came out of nowhere which makes me…
So i was driving on Eglinton Avenue East near Rosemount Ave.
The school bus was on the the curb on the opposite side of the road while i was travelling on the middle lane of the three-laned Eglinton Avenue East (five lanes apart plus a raised median island seperating the traffic)
I could not see the school bus as my view of the bus was being obstructed by the cars in front of me and on my left hand…
Lots of good information on getting disclosure from the Crown here.
Now, I am just wondering if I will be relying upon evidence of my own at trial... do I have to voluntarily send this material to the Crown in a reasonable time before the trial, or only if they request disclosure from me?
This morning I had an exam for university. I was studying the entire night and i wanted to catch like maybe 1-2 hours of sleep before the exam so i went to sleep. I woke up like 5 hrs after and realize that I was about to miss my exam. I still could have made it so I asked my dad for his car since I was in a huge rush and he gave it to me.
I went on the highway and I was going at 135 km/h but…
the police officer was in in the opesite oncumming lane he was fallowing another car so close that i was not even able to see his cruser till he was buy he said that i was going 111 in a 80 he said he hade me on radar he only asked for me drivers licencs and never asked for my insurence so on the ticket there no insurence dose enyone think i can beat this i wana take it to cort becuse he was…
Hi I have a couple questions so I'll explain my situation and any advice would be appreciated.
Can't remember exact date so lets call it some time in 2008 I got a fine for $5000.00 for driving without in insurance. I never paid the fine and in 2012 I was pulled over and the officer asked to see my license. Although I had it on me I figured it would be under suspension for the unpaid fine from…
Alright, so I did something really stupid the other day, I was driving down a country road and wanted to hit the curves so I passed 3 cars at once, inadvertently making it up to very much past 50 over (80 limit)... Much to my chagrin there was a cop coming in the opposite direction who immediately skidded on the gravel shoulder and who I thought was 100% going to turn around and pull me over,…
Anyone know how backed this courthouse is? I submitted my ticket for trial at the end of August, and still no letter. Im scared it got lost in the mail, can i call the courthouse and find out my courtdate? Or would i have to go in personally?
I recently received a ticket for failure to use low beams - while following - Ticket was issued Sec 168 (
- it was on the 401 and no one was within 500 meters of me, I was warning a oncoming vehicle that there was an officer hiding (which is not illegal or I could not find a law against it) it was a police vehicle travelling at very high rate of speed in the opposite direction with no lights on…
I received a warning letter from MTO for a 2pts ticket.What happened is that the police officer issued a "unsafe left turn" and then changed the ticket to "failed to signal" at the scene, but she submitted both tickets!!! And I !!!ONLY!!! received the latter ticket from her(I requested trial for "failed to signal"). I recently received notice from MTO that I'm convicted for "unsafe left turn".
Hello everyone! I was given a ticket for using a hand-held communication device while driving. It was 3 am, I was at a stop light and the cop saw me with the my phone in my hand. I told him i was just checking the time on it. I received the notes a few weeks ago ill copy them down below. Any help is appreciated although i believe there's no hope for me. The cop recorded me saying what phone i…
I got pulled over about 15 or so days ago the court till this date has not received the summons what is the legal time period that the court has to follow to accept the summons from the office court says its 15 days is the legal timeframe the officer has to serve it on the court
I requested for disclosure of information two months ago.
I received the radar manual after one month, but not others (including maintenance/calibration record of the radar, certificate of police training). On further pursuit, the prosecutor told me that he did not have them and he did not see why I needed these documents. He said he did not know where to get them when I asked.
Last Friday I was pulled over by an OPP motorcycle cop who informed me I was going 134. I was on the SB 404, I did see him parked under a bridge and when I passed him he was not on his bike.
I'm hoping to get some insight for a defense in this case.
I was in lane 1 and I had a car in front of me, and a car behind me, also there was a car speeding down Lane 3 passing everyone and moved quickly into…