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Ontario Highway Traffic Act

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Nabbed on the 400
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 02, 2013 7:20 pm 
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This is a great and very informative site! Here's my particular scenario: I was in a group of cars coming over the crest of a hill on the 400 near Inisfill. I don't think I was the fastest vehicle. I saw the OPP cruiser immediately and, like everyone else, slowed down. My passenger chastised me for going over 120. The cruiser starts up or at least goes into drive and enters the highway. I was in the center lane and had moved to the slow or right lane. The vehicle on my left and right did the same. The cruisers lights go on and I am expecting that he is going to pull over someone else, however when he doesn't go around me, I pull over. He says, you were going a little fast and takes my license. After awhile he comes back with a ticket for 144 in a 100 zone. My passenger and I were completely shocked!
The ticket has Lidar written on it and seems to have all the relevant info.
I have read quite a lot of the info on this site and on FYST, so I know about disclosure, LIDAR issues, etc.
Therefore, I have some questions: When do you start counting the 15 days to plead not guilty? And do holidays and weekends count. The ticket is from July 23, 2013.
What is the likelihood I will be given a plea bargain and reduction?
Are paralegals worth the money?
Thanks


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Re: Nabbed on the 400
PostPosted: Sat Aug 03, 2013 9:10 am 
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I believe the 15 days start the day after service and include holidays and weekends unless the 15 days expires on a holiday or weekend day. If that is the case, then the next day is the expiration day.
The likelihood of a plea bargain depends on a number of things, including whether the officer reduced the charge at roadside, your prior driving convictions, etc..


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Re: Nabbed on the 400, a couple more questions
PostPosted: Sat Aug 03, 2013 10:43 am 
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Thanks for the quick reply, Decatur.
So that would mean I have to get the reply to them by August 7.
There was no roadside deduction.
My driving record is pretty clean. Maybe 5 tickets in 40 years.
What about hiring one of those paralegal services?
If I indicate that I'm going to fight it in court and then get disclosure and decide its not worth it, can I pay the original fine without having to go to court?


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Re: Nabbed on the 400
PostPosted: Sat Aug 03, 2013 12:14 pm 
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I'm not a big fan of a paralegal services for things which you may do just as easily yourself. It all depends on how much time you can spare if you want to fight the ticket.
You can always pay the original fine at any time up to the point of trial.
It can never hurt to get disclosure and see if the prosecutor will take a deal. All it costs is your time.


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Re: Nabbed on the 400
PostPosted: Fri Aug 09, 2013 5:03 pm 
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Hi, something similar happened to me. Got nailed 40 over and in shock as well. Going to fight it myself.

All the paralegals I called tell me upfront that a win is reducing the fine WTF I can do that myself just by stepping foot in court.

My question is: where on the ticket said LIDAR? My ticket doesn't say what he used. I know he was pointing at me cause I saw him aiming (he was stationed in a ditch). I was hoping to know once I asked for disclosure.


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Re: Nabbed on the 400
PostPosted: Fri Aug 09, 2013 6:56 pm 
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salem2210 wrote:
HMy question is: where on the ticket said LIDAR? My ticket doesn't say what he used. I know he was pointing at me cause I saw him aiming (he was stationed in a ditch). I was hoping to know once I asked for disclosure.


How the officer determined your speed isn't listed on the ticket. You need to request disclosure to find out.


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Re: Nabbed on the 400
PostPosted: Tue Oct 08, 2013 6:33 pm 
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I received my trial notice and am about to send my disclosure request. Would it be a good idea to ask for GPS coordinates and a description of the terrain where the alleged offense took place and where he pulled me over. The group of cars I was in was coming over a hill. Then, I lost sight of the cruiser in my rear view mirror, because there was another hill and he had to get on the road and catch up. Where I was pulled over was some distance from where the cruiser was parked.


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Re: Nabbed on the 400
PostPosted: Tue Oct 08, 2013 6:34 pm 
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On my ticket it clearly says LIDAR at the top.


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Re: Nabbed on the 400
PostPosted: Tue Oct 08, 2013 7:46 pm 
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TheForce wrote:
I received my trial notice and am about to send my disclosure request. Would it be a good idea to ask for GPS coordinates and a description of the terrain where the alleged offense took place and where he pulled me over. The group of cars I was in was coming over a hill. Then, I lost sight of the cruiser in my rear view mirror, because there was another hill and he had to get on the road and catch up. Where I was pulled over was some distance from where the cruiser was parked.
GPS coordinates and a description of the terrain are not essential elements for the prosecution to get a conviction for a speeding offense in Ontario.

The prosecution will only give you the notes the officers wrote shortly after his encounter with you. If you do request for the additional items, the prosecution may force you to explain their relevance in front of a JP before giving it you (if they have it).

No one can stop you from asking the officer these questions during cross-examination, but he'll most likely say IDK for the GPS and maybe describe the terrain.

topic5345.html#p29755
Passing Thru wrote:
You can not testify to what someone else saw. In addition to that I have won many cases where I have lost sight of a vehicle before stopping it. There are many ways to qualify to the court that the vehicle is the same one.


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Re: Nabbed on the 400
PostPosted: Wed Oct 09, 2013 6:41 pm 
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Thanks for the reply iFly55. I'll keep the GPS and terrain for cross examination or second disclosure request. It may not be necessary for the crown's case, but, until I at least see the officer's notes, it's crucial to my defense. Unless LIDAR can bend over hills, or there was someone else tracking the car, the way in which the the officer obtained the reading defies physics. He would have had to sweep very quickly between at least 3 vehicles in a very short distance. I honestly think he made a mistake.


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Re: Nabbed on the 400
PostPosted: Wed Oct 16, 2013 1:09 pm 
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TheForce: When is your court date? I just requested disclosure. Mine is on Feb 4th.


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Re: Nabbed on the 400
PostPosted: Thu Jan 02, 2014 6:10 pm 
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Court date is Jan. 8, 2014. Requested disclosure on Oct. 29, 2013. Sent express post requiring a signature upon receipt. Tracked the request, it was signed for on Oct. 31, 2013. Have tried to follow up on phone today -- no one in office, so I left a message. I have so far recieved nothing. Emailed a second request today Jan. 2 2014. Any thoughts?


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Re: Nabbed on the 400
PostPosted: Fri Jan 03, 2014 3:17 pm 
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I have read that if you don't receive disclosure you can requested adjournment.
When the JP asks for your defense say you can't make one because you never received your disclosure and thus you were unable to formulate a defense against the charge. Thus you request to have this trial adjourned until the prosecution is able to provide adequate disclosure.
However, this will cancel your chance for an 11b.

They might try to give you disclosure the day of the trial. Don't agree to go to trial like that cause you have to review disclosure and think your options through.
Please let me know how does the trial go. Best of luck


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Re: Nabbed on the 400
PostPosted: Fri Jan 03, 2014 4:41 pm 
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salem2210 wrote:
I have read that if you don't receive disclosure you can requested adjournment.
When the JP asks for your defense say you can't make one because you never received your disclosure and thus you were unable to formulate a defense against the charge. Thus you request to have this trial adjourned until the prosecution is able to provide adequate disclosure.
However, this will cancel your chance for an 11b.


How will that cancel the chance at an 11b? The delay is because of the crown. The disclosure request was submitted more than 6 weeks before the trial.


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Re: Nabbed on the 400
PostPosted: Fri Jan 03, 2014 6:01 pm 
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Check this link http://forums.redflagdeals.com/archive/ ... 96266.html


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