83km in a 60km

Hi there,

Never been pulled over before so I had some question/concerns.

Stopped this morning, flow of traffic on Steeles coming from an 80km zone into a 60km zone, I was near the head of the pack with a small gap inbetween myself and the cars in front. Pulled over and officer indicated that I was going 83km/h. While I was waiting another car was also waiting. The other cars driver was out walking around and came over to talk to me he was going 82 in a 60 (I was going 83). His officer walked over and gave him his ticket right beside my car and informed him that he had dropped the ticket to 75 in a 60 and there were no points just a fine. My officercame back and gave me my ticket for the full 83km. I asked why I was receving the full ticket when the other driver had his reduced and the officer told me that it was up to the discretion of the ticketing officer. I asked him why he didn't use any discretion in my case as I've never been pulled over and his response was "I decided not to".

So I'm not sure of what I should do. I understand the options that are explained but any advice would be helpful.

There's not really any way for you to challenge the officer's decision not to use his discretion to reduce your ticket. Use of discretion in charging is, as the word indicates, completely at the officer's discretion, subject to any improper use of discretion for reasons such as racial profiling. If you want to raise that issue or some other improper motivation, you will have to bring a Charter application and prove the Charter breach on a balance of probabilities - something not easily done or undertaken lightly.

So, not that it matters, but I can tell you that the reasons why, in my experience, officers usually don't use their discretion are (1) previous convictions and (2) attitude - both of which are perfectly fine reasons, if that helps.

Thanks for the reply, I wouldn't say race was an issue so that's not an option for fighting. As for the the discretion I was very polite without being insincere and have never been pulled over before so I would have hoped that it would have helped but he was very no nonsense about everything, almost a bored attitude.

Any thoughts about fighting the ticket and hoping to get down to the 15 over/no points?

23 over in most cases will be reduced by the prosecutor to 15 over if you just ask. In my experience most prosecutors will often automatically offer a 10 km reduction and anything further than that you'd have to negotiate on - you're only seeking an 8 km reduction so that should be possible. But of course this depends on your record, any aggravating factors, etc.

Again, thanks for the responses. I'm going to take my chances, I've never been in trouble before so hopefully I'll catch the prosecuter on a good day.

Since it's Toronto, it might take a wee bit too long for them to bring the case forward. If your trial date is more than 12 months from the date of the offence, you can file an 11B motion to get the charge thrown out. It's possible, but definitely keep the plea-bargaining option as your main course of action here. (And once you get your trial date, we'll help you file a disclosure request.)

Good luck.

So as an update as of today.

I went to the court the day after the ticket was issued to get a court date. The ticket hadn't shown up in their system yet. I was told it could show up anytime the next day not specifically in the morning. Obviously not the fault of the girl who helped me so I took the phone number to call and called on Monday (now two business days after the offence). Left voicemail requesting info and was called back very quickly by a rep. asking to confirm the ticket information. She left me a voicemail a few minutes later saying that they didn't have a record of the ticket but that I could come in and book without one so that I could start the procedure.

I have to admit I'm not too pleased that the information hasn't shown up. Friends are trying to convince me that it's a good thing that maybe the officer decided not to file the ticket but since it's all electronic these days I'll believe that when I hear it from the Crown, preferably written down and notarized.

Any thoughts about it not showing up yet? (It's now Wed. so three, almost four, business days after the offence)

The officer has seven days to file the ticket with the Courts, so if you were charged last Thursday he still has until tomorrow. Even once he's filed it, there could still be a delay before it appears on their system. Maybe if you're lucky he forgot to file it, but it's still too early to be sure.

Update to close post. One of the girls at the court took my number, minds outta the gutter fellas, and called when the ticket showed up. 7th day after issue at about 4:30pm and she just happend to be there when it showed up. She booked me a first appearance for the next morning and I was able to speak with the prosecutor. I was 3rd in line and sat outside the door while I listened to the first two people give realy poor excuses and get reamed out. Neither got a deal done, both were offered and disputed and she tore a strip off them for not accepting. From what I could hear she was justified, she was dropping multiple portions of their complaints and oferring them what I thought was a fair deal but they didn't think so. My visit was quick and easy by comparison, she sat me down outlined the charge and offered me exactly what the posters on the forum said, drop to 15 over and reduce the fine significantly. That's what i was looking for and after hearing the first two people I said thanks and left. All and all it was really quick for me and I got what i wanted. Thanks for the help on here from everyone. You made me feel much better before going through the process.