19 year old G Driver
Today I received a speeding infraction on shoreham drive near York University. A speed trap had been setup.
The infraction is 63 in a 40 as the officer stated it was a school zone. Also the insurance card that was in the glove box (parents car) was expired so a further infraction was issued. The officer stated that since I was a student he would cut me a break if I could provide proof that the vehicle was insured on the date of the offence.
I have thought of quite a many ways to proceed as this is my second speeding infraction. The first was a 10 over in November 2013 and this would be the second.
I shall start with the easiest infraction to get rid of : the failure to produce insurance one,
Can I or my parents just call the insurance company and ask them to mail us/email us the insurance card ?
The officer did state that if I could provide proof that it was insured on today's date he would toss this one out
As for the speeding charge the officer informed that if he saw me in court he would try to get the ticket lowered to a 15 over as I was a student -- No points , ~~50$ fine
My question is, would it be more worthwhile to obtain disclosure? He was using LIDAR and had me from quite a distance.
As for him showing up and possible adjournments so that he may be busy or on call one of the court times, I was looking for some advice. This is Toronto Police and the courthouse is the York Civic Centre. Not sure as to how the proceedings are there as previously went to Newmarket (Davis Drive). Now the first infraction did not see an increase in insurance premiums, not sure how the second will play out. Any ideas?
any advice on how to proceed for either infraction would be appreciated, thank you.
Prosecutor will drop the insurance card if you bring evidence you were insured at the time of the offence. In a plea-deal you're guaranteed to get a no-point amendment for the speeding charge.
You should always request trial; wait for notice of trial and then request disclosure: officer notes and lidar manual
After reviewing his notes you can decide how you want to proceed
@highwaystar - thanks for the headsup as well as warnings, I'm hoping for a break either way and DID have valid insurance. (got a copy from the insurance company the same day, went back to the trap area but cop was gone. Anyhow what's done is done.
From what I understand, best scenario I walk out with a 15 over and insurance infraction gets tossed.
Worst case.. well things stay as they are.
Any idea on how slow the courts are down at the York Civic Centre and the probability of the officer showing up?
I have filed option 3 for both tickets on this matter, but what if I was to go to the courthouse and instead ask for an early resolution meeting with the prosecutor regarding only the failure to produce insurance card? I could bring proof that the vehicle was validly insured at the time and if i play my cards hopefully get the charge withdrawn before the matter even went to court. The other speeding charge would remain as is, for the courts to process and my trial date to appear. I would not even bring up the speeding charge but rather would make it possible to eliminate one matter. Documentation violations aren't really a serious charge, and plenty of people get these withdrawn anyhow. Worth a shot? Save us both some time in court? Atleast for this matter that is..
Insurance providers look at all charges. They'll treat a conviction for not having your proof of insurance the same as speeding.wmalik81 wrote:Documentation violations aren't really a serious charge
There is no space to list specific items that you want: officer's notes, laser/radar manual. If you use their form, you can't go to court and tell the JP you didn't get X, Y, and Z... because you never had opportunity to ask for it.
daggx is right, use the sample disclosure form: http://www.ontariohighwaytrafficact.com/topic2959.html
My deciphering of the above:
md ID 2 --> asked for both pieces of id?
63 @ 186.2 L1 --> clocked me at 63 using LIDAR?
c cool d --> calm, cool and dry conditions?
UL LRB --> not sure about this one, any one have any ideas?
FTP - Ins Card = Failure to Provide Insurance Card
Not sure if I should be asking for something additional at this point and time, or as to what my next move should be. Any advice is appreciated. Thanks.
NOTE: You may have to play around by cancelling the ads in order to view the images, They do work just need to cancel out the ads.
You can resubmit a new disclosure request, this time highlight the short form writing; ask for it to be explained or written in plain English for you to understand.
Additional request should be made in person? Prosecutors office does not seem to take to kindly to people exercising their rights and requesting additional disclosure. I'd rather fax it, keep the receipts and then bring it up at trial. Please advise. Thanks
a) Is it worth my while to seek additional disclosure via fax or in person? --> I would be looking for a copy of the LIDAR manual and an outline as to what exactly the officer was saying in terms of short forms --> I know disclosure says take 6-8 weeks beforehand but is it worth sending it in now? (~4 weeks). If they give it to me on trial day, am i seeking an adjournment based on the fact evidence crucial to my defence was disclosed to me just today and I am going to need reasonable time to review it and or seek legal advice?
b) I know all policies are provider specific but as for a general idea if I take the plea bargain of 15 over and insurance card tossed will i be looking at substantial premium increase? (first conviction was a 10 over back in November 2013. I am an occasional driver on my parents policy, no premium increase the first time around, not too sure about now. what's a percentage to keep in mind?
c) When taking a plea bargain, does it leave the option for the defendant to show remorse? --> in the sense that I am a student with heavy financial responsibility and loans (~20k with almost 60k by the time I graduate) and the only reason I was speeding that morning was because I was late for an exam I had for courses I pay for independently. It is no excuse to get me off the hook but will it help me in further reducing the fine? I literally have to pay an additional 5 thousand in fees very soon even 50-60$ is quite a lot to me at this point and time.
Also if anyone sees any holes in disclosure (links above) please feel free to add in.
Thank you everyone for your time. Happy Holidays.