Our website is made possible by displaying online advertisements to our visitors.
Please consider supporting us by disabling your ad blocker.

Ontario Highway Traffic Act

Discuss the Ontario Highway Traffic Act.


Post Your Traffic Ticket, and Get Help!


The Ontario Traffic Ticket Forum!


All times are UTC - 5 hours [ DST ]




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 12 posts ] 
Check It Out
No unread posts New Set Fines Starting Sept 1st, 2015! Read and Learn Here.
  Print view

Using Laser downhill and through tinted windows a violation?
Author Message
PostPosted: Thu May 29, 2014 2:58 pm 
Offline
Newbie

Joined: Wed May 28, 2014 3:34 pm
Posts: 5
According to TicketCombat.com: "The radar or laser (lidar) gun has to be on the same vector as your direction of travel." http://www.ticketcombat.com/step3/lookaround.php

Can anyone expand on this, case law or some other reference would be great.

My friend was coming down hill on a bridge on Brimley and 401. The bridge bends down a bit and isn't perfectly straight. We think the police officer was standing at the foot of the bridge with the laser gun. We think he shot through his tinted car windows too.

Because the bridge bends down and is not a perfect vector, it doesn't matter where the police officer was standing, which is great! But the manual doesn't say it's a violation using the laser on cars coming down hill or "you must be on the same vector as the target car." The manual only says to test the laser gun horizontally and vertically.

So how should my friend go about this? Also, do we need blueprints of the bridge to prove the bridge is not a vector or is taking photos of the bridge good enough?

Thanks!


Top
 Profile  
 
Re: Using Laser downhill and through tinted windows a violat
PostPosted: Thu May 29, 2014 4:42 pm 
Offline
High Authority

Joined: Tue Feb 01, 2011 9:49 pm
Posts: 2110
Location: Ontario
I believe most laser devices can be used through glass without issue. It can significantly reduce the range of the device, but not the accuracy.

I’m regards to your link, I’m really not sure what the author actually means. I think he’s simply referring to the fact that it’s more difficult for police to accurately target a vehicle on a road with bends, dips, obstructions, etc. The fact that you were going downhill wouldn’t negate the reading. Worst case it creates a minor cosine effect, which always benefits the offender by showing a slightly lower speed.


Top
 Profile  
 
Re: Using Laser downhill and through tinted windows a violat
PostPosted: Thu May 29, 2014 8:32 pm 
Offline
Moderator

Joined: Wed Sep 19, 2012 1:44 am
Posts: 1062
As Stanton pointed out, a slight bend in the road would benefit the driver anyways.


Top
 Profile  
 
Re: Using Laser downhill and through tinted windows a violat
PostPosted: Sun Jun 01, 2014 1:13 am 
Offline
Newbie

Joined: Wed May 28, 2014 3:34 pm
Posts: 5
Thanks for the replies, I thought I was on to something :oops:

Another question: does an officer serving under 11 Division have authority to set up a speed trap in 12 Division's neighbourhood boundaries?

Is the officer still within his jurisdiction if he's operating a speed trap outside of his 11 Division neighbourhood boundaries, but still within the city?

Thanks!


Top
 Profile  
 
Re: Using Laser downhill and through tinted windows a violat
PostPosted: Sun Jun 01, 2014 2:54 am 
Offline
Sr. Member

Joined: Mon Nov 29, 2010 8:08 pm
Posts: 550
notxcopper wrote:
Another question: does an officer serving under 11 Division have authority to set up a speed trap in 12 Division's neighbourhood boundaries?

Is the officer still within his jurisdiction if he's operating a speed trap outside of his 11 Division neighbourhood boundaries, but still within the city?
http://www.ontariohighwaytrafficact.com/topic1083.html#p19643


Top
 Profile  
 
Re: Using Laser downhill and through tinted windows a violat
PostPosted: Tue Jun 10, 2014 10:09 pm 
Offline
Newbie

Joined: Wed May 28, 2014 3:34 pm
Posts: 5
I found out today that they moved the speed limit sign down the road about 300 meters.

What happens now? Is the case dismissed? :mrgreen:

Is the charge for violating the speed limit sign in the old position still valid? Does one continue the good fight?

If the speed limit sign in the old position is invalid, how does one go about the charge? Does one tell the justice before the trial begins about the new sign position? Or wait until it's your turn to mount a defence?

Thanks for all the help!


Top
 Profile  
 
Re: Using Laser downhill and through tinted windows a violat
PostPosted: Tue Jun 10, 2014 11:35 pm 
Offline
Sr. Member

Joined: Mon Oct 20, 2008 11:31 pm
Posts: 502
The spot where the ticket is alleged is important. The court may not have jurisdiction if "say" you were driving from vaughn to toronto.
Maybe the boundary comes into effect?

If they screw up that stuff it is almost auto dismissed.

You do need to point it out before they can amend it though.

Object before they read the charge.

Best of luck

Cheers
Viper1

_________________
"hang onto your chair when reading my posts
use at your own risk"


Top
 Profile  
 
Re: Using Laser downhill and through tinted windows a violat
PostPosted: Wed Jun 11, 2014 12:22 am 
Offline
Moderator

Joined: Wed Sep 19, 2012 1:44 am
Posts: 1062
notxcopper wrote:
I found out today that they moved the speed limit sign down the road about 300 meters.

What happens now? Is the case dismissed? :mrgreen:

Is the charge for violating the speed limit sign in the old position still valid? Does one continue the good fight?

If the speed limit sign in the old position is invalid, how does one go about the charge? Does one tell the justice before the trial begins about the new sign position? Or wait until it's your turn to mount a defence?


It doesn't change anything. You'll continue to defend yourself as if the sign were still there. Just because it moved doesn't make it "invalid". You have no argument on whether or not the sign was properly displayed other than its since been relocated, which doesn't prove anything.


Top
 Profile  
 
Re: Using Laser downhill and through tinted windows a violat
PostPosted: Wed Jun 11, 2014 12:53 am 
Offline
Sr. Member

Joined: Mon Oct 20, 2008 11:31 pm
Posts: 502
bend wrote:
notxcopper wrote:
I found out today that they moved the speed limit sign down the road about 300 meters.

What happens now? Is the case dismissed? :mrgreen:

Is the charge for violating the speed limit sign in the old position still valid? Does one continue the good fight?

If the speed limit sign in the old position is invalid, how does one go about the charge? Does one tell the justice before the trial begins about the new sign position? Or wait until it's your turn to mount a defence?


It doesn't change anything. You'll continue to defend yourself as if the sign were still there. Just because it moved doesn't make it "invalid". You have no argument on whether or not the sign was properly displayed other than its since been relocated, which doesn't prove anything.


If the boundary changed it would mean something.

It sounds as if OP was on boarder.
I think each area has jurisdiction and it needs to be established to convict.

If OP passed a boarder or just sign was moved to proper spot I am not sure but I will bet you a beer he wins if he takes it to trial.
lol.

Cheers
Viper1

_________________
"hang onto your chair when reading my posts
use at your own risk"


Top
 Profile  
 
Re: Using Laser downhill and through tinted windows a violat
PostPosted: Wed Jun 11, 2014 1:16 am 
Offline
Sr. Member

Joined: Mon Nov 29, 2010 8:08 pm
Posts: 550
BTW was your friend going Northbound on Brimley Rd? Streetview: http://goo.gl/zq6uOZ

IMO there would be no jurisdiction issue there, it's all City of Toronto for at least a 2km radius. Lets just say that 50 km/hr sign was not there, the Highway Traffic Act would default the speed limit to 50 km/hr anyway.

http://www.torontopolice.on.ca/divisions/map.php
North of the 401, it's all 43 division.

Similar Brimley/401 story on this board: topic5589.html
Dashcam: https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B4qYsmB ... F1R1k/edit


Top
 Profile  
 
Re: Using Laser downhill and through tinted windows a violat
PostPosted: Wed Jun 11, 2014 8:34 am 
Offline
High Authority

Joined: Tue Feb 01, 2011 9:49 pm
Posts: 2110
Location: Ontario
My understanding of the Provincial Offences Act is that Courts can deal with matters from adjoining Regions. So if a Toronto officer charged someone in Peel or York, Toronto Courts should still have jurisdiction.

Quote:
29. (1) Subject to subsection (2), a proceeding in respect of an offence shall be heard and determined by the Ontario Court of Justice sitting in the county or district in which the offence occurred or in the area specified in the transfer agreement made under Part X. 2009, c. 33, Sched. 4, s. 1 (35).
Idem
(2) A proceeding in respect of an offence may be heard and determined in a county or district that adjoins that in which the offence occurred if,
(a) the court holds sittings in a place reasonably proximate to the place where the offence occurred; and
(b) the place of sitting referred to in clause (a) is named in the summons or offence notice.


Top
 Profile  
 
Re: Using Laser downhill and through tinted windows a violat
PostPosted: Wed Jun 11, 2014 10:24 am 
Offline
Newbie

Joined: Wed May 28, 2014 3:34 pm
Posts: 5
iFly55 wrote:
BTW was your friend going Northbound on Brimley Rd? Streetview: http://goo.gl/zq6uOZ

IMO there would be no jurisdiction issue there, it's all City of Toronto for at least a 2km radius. Lets just say that 50 km/hr sign was not there, the Highway Traffic Act would default the speed limit to 50 km/hr anyway.

http://www.torontopolice.on.ca/divisions/map.php
North of the 401, it's all 43 division.

Similar Brimley/401 story on this board: topic5589.html
Dashcam: https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B4qYsmB ... F1R1k/edit


Yup, that's the same spot

Just to clarify, technically my friend was north of the 401 which is 42 Division's boundary. The last posted speed limit was 60, which was near Ellemere.

bend wrote:
It doesn't change anything. You'll continue to defend yourself as if the sign were still there. Just because it moved doesn't make it "invalid". You have no argument on whether or not the sign was properly displayed other than its since been relocated, which doesn't prove anything.


Will examining the speed limit by-laws reveal potential issues with the speed limit sign location.

Thanks all!


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 12 posts ] 

All times are UTC - 5 hours [ DST ]


Related topics
 Topics   Author   Replies   Views   Last post 
There are no new unread posts for this topic. Fines - Laser Detectors & Laser Jammers

[ Go to pageGo to page: 1, 2, 3, 4 ]

tdrive2

57

12163

Sun Oct 25, 2009 9:04 am

hwybear View the latest post

This topic is locked, you cannot edit posts or make further replies. Windows to afford clear view Sect 74

racer

0

4163

Sat Feb 07, 2009 11:51 pm

racer View the latest post

There are no new unread posts for this topic. Car Windows Tints allowance in Ontario (mississauga,gta,etc)

[ Go to pageGo to page: 1, 2 ]

jasong4

21

39386

Mon May 04, 2009 8:20 pm

knight_yyz View the latest post

There are no new unread posts for this topic. 69 in a 50 downhill.

downahill

10

989

Fri May 18, 2012 2:03 pm

Decatur View the latest post

There are no new unread posts for this topic. Downhill speedlimit change

Anton vermunt

1

673

Mon Aug 12, 2013 1:57 pm

Decatur View the latest post

There are no new unread posts for this topic. Stopped for speeding by unmarked cruiser coming downhill +29

tri4me

1

520

Fri Aug 21, 2015 9:45 am

jsherk View the latest post

There are no new unread posts for this topic. Rear-end collission, skidding downhill - Careless Driving

markhamian

2

697

Tue Jan 21, 2014 8:04 pm

markhamian View the latest post

There are no new unread posts for this topic. What kinds of Radar / Laser guns ..????

therock777

1

2251

Sat Oct 09, 2010 11:40 am

hwybear View the latest post

There are no new unread posts for this topic. JP Ignores testimony and evidence on laser testing

robmcla

10

1413

Tue Aug 03, 2010 10:28 am

Reflections View the latest post

There are no new unread posts for this topic. tagged by laser gun for exceeding 20 over, reduced to 5 over

jeffong_hk

4

758

Fri Oct 28, 2011 10:29 am

Reflections View the latest post

There are no new unread posts for this topic. Laser/Radar gun reset between tickets?

empea

5

749

Fri Jun 17, 2016 8:47 am

rank View the latest post

There are no new unread posts for this topic. Insurance - Radar Detectors & Laser Jammers

tdrive2

11

3090

Wed Apr 08, 2009 9:27 pm

tdrive2 View the latest post

 


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Web Development & Search Engine Optimization
Home | Court Listings | Ontario Traffic Ticket

Copyright 2007 - 2017 © Microtekblue Inc. Web Development & Search Engine Optimization Service. We Support phpBB All Rights Reserved.