Let me start this with saying that this isn't in regards to a ticket, more a discussion surrounding front license plates and learning about the rules behind them. (Most of the quote stuff is using colloquial terms, mostly because I couldn't really find a better way to describe it; it's not meant to be offensive.) I know Ontario law/HTA mandates having a front license plate unlike some States in the US that don't require it. However, I've seen people running plateless on the front, and simply having the plate tucked on their front windshield, whether it's for not having anywhere to attach it to, not wanting a front plate for aesthetics, or other reasons I'm not even thinking of. I completely understand that having an unsecured, thin, edged, 1-lb metal plate in your cabin is not an overly wise idea, but to each their own. So now a "few" questions about it: 1) What ticket could you get if you lack a plate at all in the front (and it's not displayed anywhere)? 2) What ticket could you get if you lack a plate on the front bumper, but have it on your dash or attached to your visor? 3) Would the ticket for #2 be a "fix-it" ticket? (A ticket where if you get it fixed, you get the ticket removed minus an admin fee.) 4) Would the ticket given in #2 be legitimate or more of an example of "well, you shouldn't have been trying to skirt the rules", and attempting to 'teach you a lesson'? 5) What would be possible defenses in court for #2? Would mounting the plate on the front and taking a picture be sufficient? I had some other stuff I wanted to ask, but I can't remember it now. Hopefully it'll come up as I get some replies.
Let me start this with saying that this isn't in regards to a ticket, more a discussion surrounding front license plates and learning about the rules behind them. (Most of the quote stuff is using colloquial terms, mostly because I couldn't really find a better way to describe it; it's not meant to be offensive.)
I know Ontario law/HTA mandates having a front license plate unlike some States in the US that don't require it. However, I've seen people running plateless on the front, and simply having the plate tucked on their front windshield, whether it's for not having anywhere to attach it to, not wanting a front plate for aesthetics, or other reasons I'm not even thinking of. I completely understand that having an unsecured, thin, edged, 1-lb metal plate in your cabin is not an overly wise idea, but to each their own.
So now a "few" questions about it:
1) What ticket could you get if you lack a plate at all in the front (and it's not displayed anywhere)?
2) What ticket could you get if you lack a plate on the front bumper, but have it on your dash or attached to your visor?
3) Would the ticket for #2 be a "fix-it" ticket? (A ticket where if you get it fixed, you get the ticket removed minus an admin fee.)
4) Would the ticket given in #2 be legitimate or more of an example of "well, you shouldn't have been trying to skirt the rules", and attempting to 'teach you a lesson'?
5) What would be possible defenses in court for #2? Would mounting the plate on the front and taking a picture be sufficient?
I had some other stuff I wanted to ask, but I can't remember it now. Hopefully it'll come up as I get some replies.
1) Drive Motor Vehicle - Fail to Display Two Plates 7(1)(b)(i) HTA - $85/$110 2) Same as above if the officer can articulate in Court why the plate isn't readily visible on the dash, etc. 3) No such thing in Ontario. Some officers will give motorists a chance to fix the problem before submitting the ticket as a courtesy, but it's not a legal requirement. 4) I would argue no, but it might vary from case to case. Again, it would depend how visible the plate is, etc. Especially at night I'd argue it's much easier to see a plate on the exterior of the vehicle versus interior. 5) Some busier jurisdictions may not proceed with the charge if you show the Crown you've fixed the problem, but it's not a legal defence at trial.
1) Drive Motor Vehicle - Fail to Display Two Plates 7(1)(b)(i) HTA - $85/$110
2) Same as above if the officer can articulate in Court why the plate isn't readily visible on the dash, etc.
3) No such thing in Ontario. Some officers will give motorists a chance to fix the problem before submitting the ticket as a courtesy, but it's not a legal requirement.
4) I would argue no, but it might vary from case to case. Again, it would depend how visible the plate is, etc. Especially at night I'd argue it's much easier to see a plate on the exterior of the vehicle versus interior.
5) Some busier jurisdictions may not proceed with the charge if you show the Crown you've fixed the problem, but it's not a legal defence at trial.
Section 7 1 b i also indicates the the number plates have to be displaced in the prescribed manner. The "prescibed manner" is in Regulation 628 and says: "The number plates for a motor vehicle, other than a motorcycle or a motor assisted bicycle, shall be attached to and exposed in a conspicuous position on the front and rear of the motor vehicle." The front is traditonally the leading edge of the bumper.
Section 7 1 b i also indicates the the number plates have to be displaced in the prescribed manner. The "prescibed manner" is in Regulation 628 and says: "The number plates for a motor vehicle, other than a motorcycle or a motor assisted bicycle, shall be attached to and exposed in a conspicuous position on the front and rear of the motor vehicle." The front is traditonally the leading edge of the bumper.
For those thinking about arguing "what is front and what isn't", it's not going to matter. Your plate on your dash or visor is obstructed. Officers aren't expected to go out of their way to read your plate. - Windshields and dashes aren't angled straight. - Windshields glare. - Vehicle height on either the police vehicle or the car in question may impact the visibility of a plate on a dash. The list goes on and on. People who display their plates on their dash are only fooling themselves. It's as good as not using a plate at all.
For those thinking about arguing "what is front and what isn't", it's not going to matter. Your plate on your dash or visor is obstructed. Officers aren't expected to go out of their way to read your plate.
- Windshields and dashes aren't angled straight.
- Windshields glare.
- Vehicle height on either the police vehicle or the car in question may impact the visibility of a plate on a dash.
The list goes on and on. People who display their plates on their dash are only fooling themselves. It's as good as not using a plate at all.
It's hard to say what the actually penalty is for having "NO front plate".. I cannot find anywhere in any statue or regulation where the fine or penalty is stated (i.e any points? does it show up on your abstract etc..) Stanton - I checked your reference HTA 7(1)(b)(i) -got nothing - did you get it from regulation or from the act itself? Thanks All! :)
Stanton wrote:
1) Drive Motor Vehicle - Fail to Display Two Plates 7(1)(b)(i) HTA - $85/$110
2) Same as above if the officer can articulate in Court why the plate isn't readily visible on the dash, etc.
3) No such thing in Ontario. Some officers will give motorists a chance to fix the problem before submitting the ticket as a courtesy, but it's not a legal requirement.
4) I would argue no, but it might vary from case to case. Again, it would depend how visible the plate is, etc. Especially at night I'd argue it's much easier to see a plate on the exterior of the vehicle versus interior.
5) Some busier jurisdictions may not proceed with the charge if you show the Crown you've fixed the problem, but it's not a legal defence at trial.
It's hard to say what the actually penalty is for having "NO front plate".. I cannot find anywhere in any statue or regulation where the fine or penalty is stated (i.e any points? does it show up on your abstract etc..)
Stanton - I checked your reference HTA 7(1)(b)(i) -got nothing - did you get it from regulation or from the act itself?
It's in the general penalties section of the provincial offences act, standard is $85 plus cost and surcharge totalling $110, but extenuating circumstances (previous convictions etc) can raise that to $600 in court, plus cost and surcharge. I had a fella here who just refused to put on cause he didn't like the look of it on his sportscar, third time I stopped him (in about 1 year) I gave him a part III summons and the JP handed out the max fine...he put his front plate on.
It's in the general penalties section of the provincial offences act, standard is $85 plus cost and surcharge totalling $110, but extenuating circumstances (previous convictions etc) can raise that to $600 in court, plus cost and surcharge. I had a fella here who just refused to put on cause he didn't like the look of it on his sportscar, third time I stopped him (in about 1 year) I gave him a part III summons and the JP handed out the max fine...he put his front plate on.
1) There are no demerit points. Demerit points are listed under regulation 339/94 of the HTA here: http://www.canlii.org/en/on/laws/regu/o ... 39-94.html 2) The offence will appear on your driving abstract and could impact your insurance rates. 3) The Ontario Court of Justice has a list of set fines here: http://www.ontariocourts.ca/ocj/how-do- ... hedule-43/
WhiteBird wrote:
It's hard to say what the actually penalty is for having "NO front plate".. I cannot find anywhere in any statue or regulation where the fine or penalty is stated (i.e any points? does it show up on your abstract etc..)
Stanton - I checked your reference HTA 7(1)(b)(i) -got nothing - did you get it from regulation or from the act itself?
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