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3 Tickets in 3 days but the third ticket is demerit points
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 18, 2012 12:31 pm 
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Joined: Wed Jan 18, 2012 10:09 am
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I guess they are clamping done or funding is running out.

However, this regards my 3rd ticket I got today. I was coming off the 401 at Neilson going westbound when my wife realised that we can take progress from Markham so instead off turning left on onto Neilson I went over and was promptly stopped by the officer who was waiting there for what I guess is short cut takers in morning rush hour. The signs on the road said right and left turn and technically I did a slight right turn. But nonetheless went over, there is no sign prohibiting this but I guess the arrows on the road prohibit this.

My concern is that I cannot take the hit on insurance with the demerit points I am happy to pay the fine (well not happy) is there a way to say guilty but don't give me demerit points??
thanks in Advance

PJ

PS my other tickets are 75 in a 60 zone and talking on speaker phone and trying to end the call anyhelp on reducing these would be appreciated though the cop did say if I go in they would consider dropping one of the tickets, but not sure what he meant


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Re: 3 Tickets in 3 days but the third ticket is demerit poin
PostPosted: Wed Jan 18, 2012 6:46 pm 
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Joined: Tue Feb 01, 2011 9:49 pm
Posts: 2110
Location: Ontario
I'm not sure I understand what you did. Are you saying you went straight through to get back on the 401 or you did turn off? What were you actually charged with?

In regards to the arrows painted onto the ground, they're not legally enforceable. What you'd have to look for (and what appear to be there on Googlemaps) are the black square signs with white arrows. If such signs exist, you can only proceed in the direction indicated for the specified lane.

FYI, insurance companies don't look at demerit points, they simply look at convictions. While all your charges are likely considered minor, three will quite likely result in an insurance increase. I'd definitely look at working out some type of plea deal to get a charge dropped.


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Re: 3 Tickets in 3 days but the third ticket is demerit poin
PostPosted: Thu Jan 19, 2012 9:48 am 
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Thank you for the advice,

Sorry if I wasn't clear, I came off at Neilson looking to find Progess road, wife in the front seat realised that Neilson wasn't the exist and I should take Markham exit to get to Progress Road. The sign was way back on the off ramp and the turning I made was a sort of a right turn to take the 401 onramp. I was charged with (whats written on the ticket) Disobey sign HTA 182(2). It looked like the same officer was there today as my wife turned to check I guess its a hotspot for this sort of driving.

I was considering a plea deal but I am new to Canada and don't fully understand the plea system itself. I've read that I can plea to get a non-moving violation and pay more for the fine is this correct? I was thinking of making a plea deal for the first two (hoping for only one charge). I'm not sure about the third but again will make a plea deal will read up some more on the matter.


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Re: 3 Tickets in 3 days but the third ticket is demerit poin
PostPosted: Thu Jan 19, 2012 9:19 pm 
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Joined: Sat Feb 05, 2011 5:21 pm
Posts: 77
If you look at http://www.e-laws.gov.on.ca/html/statutes/french/elaws_statutes_90h08_f.htm#s141s7, it basically states that when making a turn from a designated turning lane (there are signs there, like stanton said), you must turn into the corresponding lane on the roadway you're turning onto. Failure to do so is why you got the disobey sign ticket.

Honestly, I think that the plea guilty with no demerit points is a scam to get people to avoid a trial.... demerit points don't mean much unless you've accumulated so many that you have to go to the interview, but even that is a joke, I used to know a few people that had been to several of those interviews, and were still allowed to drive.

If I were in your situation, I might consider hiring a para legal to help me out. I just got done dealing with a red light ticket and I used a para legal since I was unfamiliar with court procedures, and I was born and raised here, lol.

Something else for you to consider is, if you or your wife have the time, go and sit through a few court sessions to see how they work. They're open to the public, so you can go in and watch, and possibly talk to other people that are there fighting tickets, to find out how they're handling it.


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Re: 3 Tickets in 3 days but the third ticket is demerit poin
PostPosted: Fri Jan 20, 2012 9:42 am 
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Joined: Wed Jan 18, 2012 10:09 am
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thank you, I know rates varies with para legal but do you have a rough range on what they charge?

I was thinking about going to trial as that day and subsequent days the officer or different one has been waiting there. Also that he was with another vehicle the time he pulled me over. I was going to use that the officer was writing up another ticket and therefore could not be 100% sure that I came from that direction as a defence.

Or ask for a plea guilty in which I can get the demerit points for a non moving violation, I have still to read up about this but hoping there is one. Is it difficult to get the tickets downgraded or upgraded to a non moving violation?

I apologise for the questions but few unforeseen events have led us to be financially against a rock and hard place with me out of work


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Re: 3 Tickets in 3 days but the third ticket is demerit poin
PostPosted: Fri Jan 20, 2012 7:40 pm 
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Joined: Tue Feb 01, 2011 9:49 pm
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Location: Ontario
pjpatel707 wrote:
Or ask for a plea guilty in which I can get the demerit points for a non moving violation, I have still to read up about this but hoping there is one. Is it difficult to get the tickets downgraded or upgraded to a non moving violation?


Again, Ontario insurance providers treat all tickets the same, regardless of demerit points. So in other words, having an expired licence plate is treated the same as going 30 over the limit. There's no difference between so called moving and non moving violations.

The only option is to see if there's a local bylaw you can plead to instead of an HTA charge. Most bylaw charges (with the exception of some relating to turns) don't have demerit points and won't appear on your conviction history.


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Re: 3 Tickets in 3 days but the third ticket is demerit poin
PostPosted: Fri Jan 20, 2012 7:57 pm 
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Joined: Sat Feb 05, 2011 5:21 pm
Posts: 77
The paralegal I used charged me $250 plus tax to handle my red light ticket. Another one quoted me $350 + tax. It might cost you more depending on the number of tickets you want to fight.

You most likely can plea guilty and get no demerit points, but like Stanton says, it really doesn't make any difference to your insurance premiums. For example, if you get an online insurance quote, they don't bother asking you how many demerit points you have. Demerit points have more to do with the MTO, if you collect too many you have to go to an interview to explain why you should keep your licence. Six points is the point when this first happens, if memory serves.


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