Hey everyone, first off just want to say how incredible this forum is and how much knowledge is provided. I have a meeting with a prosecutor for early resolution, when I scheduled the meeting I asked the girl working if I can request full disclosure before going to the meeting, she replied no only the prosecutor has the officers notes. My question is - can I request full disclosure of the officers notes before the meeting? The reason being is I'd like to know what evidence there is against me and have full knowledge of the situation before I go in and talk about a plea. For example, what if I know I have a winning case due to flimsy evidence, and without the disclosure, I risk accepting a plea. Thanks!
Hey everyone, first off just want to say how incredible this forum is and how much knowledge is provided.
I have a meeting with a prosecutor for early resolution, when I scheduled the meeting I asked the girl working if I can request full disclosure before going to the meeting, she replied no only the prosecutor has the officers notes.
My question is - can I request full disclosure of the officers notes before the meeting?
The reason being is I'd like to know what evidence there is against me and have full knowledge of the situation before I go in and talk about a plea. For example, what if I know I have a winning case due to flimsy evidence, and without the disclosure, I risk accepting a plea.
You can request disclosure any time after a charge has been laid...others on this site would have you believe you have to wait until you have requested a trial...not so...
You can request disclosure any time after a charge has been laid...others on this site would have you believe you have to wait until you have requested a trial...not so...
Thanks! My meeting with prosecutor is Oct 6 - will I receive it in time? Also, I am planning on submitting a full disclosure request, and aside from the officers notes there are some other things I am going to be requesting (officer used a radar gun, based on some research there's certain things I should request for). Will I be able to get this in time? Can I use any of this to my advantage when dealing with the prosecutor?
screeech wrote:
You can request disclosure any time after a charge has been laid...others on this site would have you believe you have to wait until you have requested a trial...not so...
Thanks! My meeting with prosecutor is Oct 6 - will I receive it in time?
Also, I am planning on submitting a full disclosure request, and aside from the officers notes there are some other things I am going to be requesting (officer used a radar gun, based on some research there's certain things I should request for).
Will I be able to get this in time? Can I use any of this to my advantage when dealing with the prosecutor?
You can request disclosure anytime, but the prosecutor does not have to have it for you at the early resolution meeting. They may have it or they may not. They only have to have it for you by the trial.
You can request disclosure anytime, but the prosecutor does not have to have it for you at the early resolution meeting. They may have it or they may not. They only have to have it for you by the trial.
They should have it for you before the trial, not at the time for trial. If you have not received it far enough in advance as to be able to go over it and prepare a proper defence, you can ask for an adjournment...How much time before would be a question for the JP to make a determination on...2 days, 1 week, 3 weeks? each JP is different...
They should have it for you before the trial, not at the time for trial. If you have not received it far enough in advance as to be able to go over it and prepare a proper defence, you can ask for an adjournment...How much time before would be a question for the JP to make a determination on...2 days, 1 week, 3 weeks? each JP is different...
Thanks guys. I was reading some of your posts Jsherk regarding requesting disclosure of radar/lidar manual. I've learned a ton and I'm wondering if it's a useful strategy to go into the meeting with the prosecutor and perhaps show him that I'm well informed, will not accept a plea, and prepared to battle it out in trial - and that I'll be requesting a ton of things for disclosure that I need in order to make full answer to my charge. Basically I want the prosecutor to get the feeling of "oh man, I don't want to waste my time with this guy, he's going to be annoying and difficult" and dismiss it. What do you guys think? Is that even possible?
Thanks guys.
I was reading some of your posts Jsherk regarding requesting disclosure of radar/lidar manual. I've learned a ton and I'm wondering if it's a useful strategy to go into the meeting with the prosecutor and perhaps show him that I'm well informed, will not accept a plea, and prepared to battle it out in trial - and that I'll be requesting a ton of things for disclosure that I need in order to make full answer to my charge.
Basically I want the prosecutor to get the feeling of "oh man, I don't want to waste my time with this guy, he's going to be annoying and difficult" and dismiss it.
Sounds like you're just wasting everyone's time that day, including your own. You should have just asked for a trial. They are not going to be intimidated by a laundry list of disclosure requests. They'll end up giving you the notes and a couple pages out of the testing procedures. They'll leave you to explain to the JP why you need what you need. I'd suggest you don't simply copy and paste someones template without knowing what you're even asking for. They wont care. They'll tell you to wait for your Notice of Trial in the mail and move on to the next person.
arzon wrote:
I was reading some of your posts Jsherk regarding requesting disclosure of radar/lidar manual. I've learned a ton and I'm wondering if it's a useful strategy to go into the meeting with the prosecutor and perhaps show him that I'm well informed, will not accept a plea, and prepared to battle it out in trial - and that I'll be requesting a ton of things for disclosure that I need in order to make full answer to my charge.
Sounds like you're just wasting everyone's time that day, including your own. You should have just asked for a trial.
They are not going to be intimidated by a laundry list of disclosure requests. They'll end up giving you the notes and a couple pages out of the testing procedures. They'll leave you to explain to the JP why you need what you need. I'd suggest you don't simply copy and paste someones template without knowing what you're even asking for.
arzon wrote:
Basically I want the prosecutor to get the feeling of "oh man, I don't want to waste my time with this guy, he's going to be annoying and difficult" and dismiss it.
They wont care. They'll tell you to wait for your Notice of Trial in the mail and move on to the next person.
Sounds like you're just wasting everyone's time that day, including your own. You should have just asked for a trial. They are not going to be intimidated by a laundry list of disclosure requests. They'll end up giving you the notes and a couple pages out of the testing procedures. They'll leave you to explain to the JP why you need what you need. I'd suggest you don't simply copy and paste someones template without knowing what you're even asking for. They wont care. They'll tell you to wait for your Notice of Trial in the mail and move on to the next person. Thanks Bend. Is there anyway to get the case dropped/dismissed during an early resolution? Or is that pretty much impossible
bend wrote:
arzon wrote:
I was reading some of your posts Jsherk regarding requesting disclosure of radar/lidar manual. I've learned a ton and I'm wondering if it's a useful strategy to go into the meeting with the prosecutor and perhaps show him that I'm well informed, will not accept a plea, and prepared to battle it out in trial - and that I'll be requesting a ton of things for disclosure that I need in order to make full answer to my charge.
Sounds like you're just wasting everyone's time that day, including your own. You should have just asked for a trial.
They are not going to be intimidated by a laundry list of disclosure requests. They'll end up giving you the notes and a couple pages out of the testing procedures. They'll leave you to explain to the JP why you need what you need. I'd suggest you don't simply copy and paste someones template without knowing what you're even asking for.
arzon wrote:
Basically I want the prosecutor to get the feeling of "oh man, I don't want to waste my time with this guy, he's going to be annoying and difficult" and dismiss it.
They wont care. They'll tell you to wait for your Notice of Trial in the mail and move on to the next person.
Thanks Bend. Is there anyway to get the case dropped/dismissed during an early resolution? Or is that pretty much impossible
There would have to be something extremely wrong with the case to have it tossed out before a trial. You did not list any details of the stop, is there something about this that makes you believe it should be thrown out?
There would have to be something extremely wrong with the case to have it tossed out before a trial. You did not list any details of the stop, is there something about this that makes you believe it should be thrown out?
You run the risk of getting his back up and making it a mission to beat you at trial. Crowns are human after all.
arzon wrote:
Thanks guys.
I was reading some of your posts Jsherk regarding requesting disclosure of radar/lidar manual. I've learned a ton and I'm wondering if it's a useful strategy to go into the meeting with the prosecutor and perhaps show him that I'm well informed, will not accept a plea, and prepared to battle it out in trial - and that I'll be requesting a ton of things for disclosure that I need in order to make full answer to my charge.
Basically I want the prosecutor to get the feeling of "oh man, I don't want to waste my time with this guy, he's going to be annoying and difficult" and dismiss it.
What do you guys think? Is that even possible?
You run the risk of getting his back up and making it a mission to beat you at trial. Crowns are human after all.
Former Ontario Police Officer. Advice will become less relevant as the time goes by !
You run the risk of getting his back up and making it a mission to beat you at trial. Crowns are human after all. Thanks, that makes sense.
argyll wrote:
arzon wrote:
Thanks guys.
I was reading some of your posts Jsherk regarding requesting disclosure of radar/lidar manual. I've learned a ton and I'm wondering if it's a useful strategy to go into the meeting with the prosecutor and perhaps show him that I'm well informed, will not accept a plea, and prepared to battle it out in trial - and that I'll be requesting a ton of things for disclosure that I need in order to make full answer to my charge.
Basically I want the prosecutor to get the feeling of "oh man, I don't want to waste my time with this guy, he's going to be annoying and difficult" and dismiss it.
What do you guys think? Is that even possible?
You run the risk of getting his back up and making it a mission to beat you at trial. Crowns are human after all.
I don't have any details of the stop as I don't have the full disclosure of the officer's notes, which is the reason for this post. Basically I was pulled over doing 43km over... it was on highway 7, where it's normally 80km/hr for like 8km, however it JUST transformed into a 60 zone and he caught me literally at the transition. He mentioned how fast I was going, but he didn't provide any radar info at the stop, I'm assuming he used radar as he was posted in a trap. My defense would have to poke holes regarding the radar. But as mentioned, without the officer's notes I am not aware of the evidence used against me, so walking into the meeting is like going unarmed into battle.. which of course I would prefer to avoid by having full knowledge.
screeech wrote:
There would have to be something extremely wrong with the case to have it tossed out before a trial. You did not list any details of the stop, is there something about this that makes you believe it should be thrown out?
I don't have any details of the stop as I don't have the full disclosure of the officer's notes, which is the reason for this post.
Basically I was pulled over doing 43km over... it was on highway 7, where it's normally 80km/hr for like 8km, however it JUST transformed into a 60 zone and he caught me literally at the transition.
He mentioned how fast I was going, but he didn't provide any radar info at the stop, I'm assuming he used radar as he was posted in a trap.
My defense would have to poke holes regarding the radar. But as mentioned, without the officer's notes I am not aware of the evidence used against me, so walking into the meeting is like going unarmed into battle.. which of course I would prefer to avoid by having full knowledge.
Personally I think early resolution is usually a waste of time, unless you have something specific that will pretty much guarantee them dropping the charge when you show it to them. The best you can expect at the early resolution is that the prosecutor MIGHT offer you a plea deal to something like 29 over. But without disclosure it just means an extra visit and then going back for trial date as well, and they may or may not still offer you the plea deal at trial.
Personally I think early resolution is usually a waste of time, unless you have something specific that will pretty much guarantee them dropping the charge when you show it to them.
The best you can expect at the early resolution is that the prosecutor MIGHT offer you a plea deal to something like 29 over.
But without disclosure it just means an extra visit and then going back for trial date as well, and they may or may not still offer you the plea deal at trial.
I will be going to trial for my red light camera offence.
I'll be arguing two issues, centered on the fact that there are two essential elements of 144(18) - a) a vehicle approaching the intersection shall stop; and b) the vehicle shall not proceed until green. Both essential elements must be contravened beyond a reasonable doubt to be an offence.
1) My ticket says I (being the owner) am "charged…
I know that the RIDE program has been covered extensively in these great forums, but I have a question about the stop itself:
I recently was stopped for a RIDE Program and the officer asked me to roll the window down all of the way (I had it at half and could easily communicate with them). I told them that I could hear them just fine and they insisted I roll it down all of the way. Again I told…
Not sure the right place for this so if it needs to be moved please do so.
I was stopped today for 15 over the speed limit, I gave all the documents to the officer and he said he could not accept a photocopy of my ownership only the original I had a photo copy front and back and I had my plate sticker number with it.
he gave me a ticket for HWY ACT Section 7(5)(a) he said only the original would…
Hey! I'm from Sudbury Ontario. Hope that general talk is fine for this subject
I am very serious about looking for exact ruling about underfacing lighting
Section 14 clearly states:
Red and blue lights to the front restricted
(14.1) In addition to the lighting requirements in this Part, a police department vehicle may carry lamps that cast red and blue lights, but no other motor vehicle shall carry…
i was driving my dad's car when i was caught by the red light camera in Brampton. My dad would've to take time off work to go ask for a trial and then go to one.
Can i represent him? if yes, what do i need to do?
I was pulled over and told I went through a red light during a right turn. I learned through a friend who is a police constable that the one who pulled me over is new to the job (under a year, and possibly even the first month or two of real duty).
I was given a ticket for $180. I have some questions:
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I got a ticket for 'Disobey Stop Sign' in November of 2013 (in York Region), requested disclosure and went to court in August of 2014. At my first appearance, I did not plea but requested an ajournment to to consult legal advice. The JOP set the next appearance in September.
I contacted a paralegal about my options. He told me that on my next appearance, if the police officer did not show, the…
I had a trial and found guilty, but the trial seemed to go wrong since the beginning.
The JP asked me if i am intending to take the stand- I said NO.
I asked how to submit my evidence-documents and photos.
JP said-i have to take the stand if i want to submit evidence.(Now i am finding this is wrong-i could introduce my evidence during cross examination and my defense would be much stronger)
Ottawa, Canada (AHN) - Beginning Tuesday, or April Fool's Day 2008, fines on Quebec drivers caught overspeeding will be doubled. It is not only the money penalty that will go up, but also demerit points.
The new law, Bill 42, is similar to Ontario's street racing rule. It stipulates fines for motorists who drive at over 40 km/h at under 60 km/h zones, speed at 50 km/h at 60 to 90 km/h areas and…
Make big trucks go slower and the roads will become safer.
Obvious, isn't it? It's also obvious when you look out the window that the world is flat.
Last Monday, truckers in Ontario tried to mount a convoy to Queen's Park to show their opposition to electronic speed limiters. These devices, electronic chips in trucks' engine management systems, restrict speeds…
I was out on a four lane highway around Orangeville Ontario and I noticed a school bus coming south (I was going north). I kept my eyes on the bus in case it was going to stop. As I approached it, it was slowing down a little, but no lights, and especially no arm with the STOP sign. As I was just about to pass the bus, I still did not see the lights, nor did I see the STOP sign.
Hey everyone first off I'd like to say great website, I have been reading and it is very useful
I'm posting today as I'd like to get some feedback on my situation and have a couple of questions. Please excuse the vagueness in some areas - I don't want my case to be identifiable given the small town.
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My son was making a right turn at the intersection he had a green so slowed down looked and proceeded into the turn. It was pouring rain and the was a big pool of water as he got arround the curb. He tried to keep the car going sharp right however it slid into the car making a left turn. the lane he was turning into is very narrow and at a very busy corner. He paniced and left the scene only…
I had an collision the other day. I was turing left and ran into a car going straight in the opposite direction. The insurance company has already determined that I'm at fault, since I made the left turn. But I'm wondering whether I should go on trail and at least I might get rid of the ticket. The ticket was under 142(1)
I was told that if I go on court, both the guy I hit and the officer who…
question for a friend of mine.....says she got a 3 day suspension for giving a A on a roadside. Thing is she wasnt driving. She is a g2 driver and the car was parked in a parking lot, she just ran out to get something and turned the car on. Can a 3 day be issued if you arent driving on a highway - (I've read for impaired it doesnt matter, but 3 day isnt criminal)? And is there any way to…
I can't find the category for this post so I'm posting it here.
Two questions...
1. Are golf carts considered a 'vehicle' under the Highway traffic act? I know carts can't drive across roads or on roads but if you try to bring one from the USA into Canada they are considered a 'vehicle'.
2. If you are on private property are you allowed to carry 'opened' alcohol in your golf cart? I know golf…
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I was driving westbound on Hwy. 8 earlier this month in North Dumfries Township, approaching the Cambridge city limits. The weather was clear and the roads were dry. I noticed a vehicle on the shoulder on my side of the road, pointing towards me. This didn't concern me right away, as it is a rural area and I sometimes see vehicles doing mail delivery. The vehicle then started accelerating and…
I was pulled over yesterday in a community safety zone and told I was doing 84 in a 50. When i passed the officer I looked at my odometer and I was only doing 64. I was given a summons on the spot to appear in court at the end of June. Do I have any chance in this if it comes down to his word over mine. I was in the car alone but have travelled these same roads every day, twice a day for 6 years…
who is at fault when :a) a passenger opens door and jumps out of vehicle onto the road with traffic. b) he gets hit by a car travelling in the adjoining lane. c) traffic lights were green. d) pedestrian crossing was further up and indicated "no crossing" light e) the vehicle that he exited from leaves the scene as soon as accident occurred. f) no charges have been laid after police filed report…
