Charged with "Proceed Contrary to sign at intersection" last year for my right turn on a green light at Bay and Bloor downtown. I pleaded not guilty and my trial is on Jan 30. This is my first traffic ticket and I'm 22, Caucasian white male driving an SUV, so I'm not sure what to say/do for my trial. I've been driving since I was 16. I rarely if ever drive in downtown Toronto, so you can imagine how shocked I was to be pulled over for turning right on a green light. Not left, right. I was driving downtown to attend class at U of T once a week and I was a full-time student at the time. What happened was I saw the sign for "no right turn on red light". I waited, stopped, for the light to turn green and then I proceeded. Apparently there are signs for "no right turn on green", but I didn't even know signs like these exist since I rarely drive downtown. Where I'm from (Markham), you can always turn right on green. A defense of "I didn't see the sign" shouldn't work, but what actually happened was that I saw the "no right turn on red light" and figured, being an experienced driver for my age, that I should wait until the light was green to proceed. I wasn't trying to be deceitful or disrespect the rules of the road, I'm still in shock that this happened. Thank-you in advance for the help. If anyone has any recommendations whether specific or general don't hesitate to reply.
Charged with "Proceed Contrary to sign at intersection" last year for my right turn on a green light at Bay and Bloor downtown. I pleaded not guilty and my trial is on Jan 30. This is my first traffic ticket and I'm 22, Caucasian white male driving an SUV, so I'm not sure what to say/do for my trial. I've been driving since I was 16.
I rarely if ever drive in downtown Toronto, so you can imagine how shocked I was to be pulled over for turning right on a green light. Not left, right. I was driving downtown to attend class at U of T once a week and I was a full-time student at the time.
What happened was I saw the sign for "no right turn on red light". I waited, stopped, for the light to turn green and then I proceeded.
Apparently there are signs for "no right turn on green", but I didn't even know signs like these exist since I rarely drive downtown. Where I'm from (Markham), you can always turn right on green. A defense of "I didn't see the sign" shouldn't work, but what actually happened was that I saw the "no right turn on red light" and figured, being an experienced driver for my age, that I should wait until the light was green to proceed.
I wasn't trying to be deceitful or disrespect the rules of the road, I'm still in shock that this happened.
Thank-you in advance for the help. If anyone has any recommendations whether specific or general don't hesitate to reply.
The fact that you didn't see the sign, or ignorance to the existence of a such a sign isn't much of a defense (as you seem to realise)...... What does the officers notes say? And (assuming you went back there to check what the sign said) what was the sign? According to google maps zoom in view, the only sign there is for northbound Bay that says no right turn between 7am-7pm (not sure how outdated that is). I've seen a couple other pics of the intersection that only have the sign you saw (no right turn on red). Would be helpful if you could explain which direction you were going, and if there were any other factors (like construction) involved. And if you can tell what the officers notes say (assuming that A) you've requested disclosure and B) you've received it. I'm not sure exactly what sign you were contrary to.
The fact that you didn't see the sign, or ignorance to the existence of a such a sign isn't much of a defense (as you seem to realise)...... What does the officers notes say? And (assuming you went back there to check what the sign said) what was the sign? According to google maps zoom in view, the only sign there is for northbound Bay that says no right turn between 7am-7pm (not sure how outdated that is). I've seen a couple other pics of the intersection that only have the sign you saw (no right turn on red).
Would be helpful if you could explain which direction you were going, and if there were any other factors (like construction) involved. And if you can tell what the officers notes say (assuming that A) you've requested disclosure and B) you've received it. I'm not sure exactly what sign you were contrary to.
Take your own pictures and present them as evidence in court. Make sure you take them, that way you can testify to the validity of them. If you don't see the sign, "no right between Time X and Time Y" then the ticket should get tossed.
Take your own pictures and present them as evidence in court. Make sure you take them, that way you can testify to the validity of them. If you don't see the sign, "no right between Time X and Time Y" then the ticket should get tossed.
http://www.OHTA.ca OR http://www.OntarioTrafficAct.com
I was going North on Bay to Bloor. Is it too late to ask for disclosure from the officer (25 days left)? Is it worth it to do so? It's been about 8 months since the conviction, so I can't say what signs where there at that time. All I can say is that there was a "no right turn on red" sign. Right now it appears that the sign 'no right turn between x and y hours' is there. I was too busy with school at the time to go on a photoshoot. Even if i take a picture now and say, "oh back then the signs where different" that's not saying anything. Maybe I can check with the city for a signage history at that intersection??? Things aren't looking good. From where the officer was stationed (on bloor) he could see the signs at the intersection but not any signs leading up to it. They may have been blocked by construction/a big truck whatnot. That might explain why I didn't see anything. But how to use that line it in court....
I was going North on Bay to Bloor. Is it too late to ask for disclosure from the officer (25 days left)? Is it worth it to do so?
It's been about 8 months since the conviction, so I can't say what signs where there at that time. All I can say is that there was a "no right turn on red" sign. Right now it appears that the sign 'no right turn between x and y hours' is there. I was too busy with school at the time to go on a photoshoot.
Even if i take a picture now and say, "oh back then the signs where different" that's not saying anything. Maybe I can check with the city for a signage history at that intersection??? Things aren't looking good.
From where the officer was stationed (on bloor) he could see the signs at the intersection but not any signs leading up to it. They may have been blocked by construction/a big truck whatnot. That might explain why I didn't see anything. But how to use that line it in court....
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