Hi everyone. Need some help here for the 1st time speeding ticket? Sunday morning 12:10am when I was going home from work I was doing bit speeding on Gardiner. I was going with about 130km/h. I know its fast. I always take the same way and I know where the cops hide. They always hide entrance of the highways. If I will do speeding I always look my back and did look this time too. I took gardiner Highway from spadina. It was good until Gardener end and DVP started soon as I took DVP I kept my speed about 120km/h. And there was a car going front of me slow and took his front. Soon as I did this I saw a car just appear from Gardiner to DVP. Distance was about 1km and there was a car between us. I knew he was a cop because of the front lights(yellow). He did not turn on his siren or lights. Distance was the same he went behind the car that I passed and I slowed down and took the midle line. Then once he saw me he speed it up and came behind me. He followed me 3.3km and exit from donmils N. Soon as exit from highway. He turn on his lights and pulled over. He came up and told me that I was speeding over 140km/h and I asked for driver license. I asked him if he wants insurance too. He said no 1st but then he said yes. He just looked at my insurance and gave it back. He didnt ask for owner ship. By the way car is my fathers and it was on his name. He took only my license and went his car. After 15 min he came up with 3 tickets. 1- speeding with over 49km which is 139km 2nd plate cover. 3rd plate sticker which I had but wasnt there but it was in owner ship which he didnt look at it. He said that He didnt give me over 50 but gave me 49 otherwise tow the car and suspend the license. Total fine about $600. Once he gave me the tickets I asked him did he catch me on radar he said yes, but I dont believe him. I think he entered the Gardener highway from jarves St and saw me going fast and followed me but we had the car between us. On the ticket he say he pulled me over DVP and DUNDAS ST (but there is no intersection like that) He pulled me DVP donmils N exit. His writing was not clear its really hard to read I believe he made couple of mistakes. Such as address wrong spelled and plate number. 641 is seems 611 or 6Y1 and etc. MY QUESTION IS HOW IMPORTAN COPS WRITING. IF ITS NOT CLEAR WHAT CAN JUDGE SAY[/img]
Hi everyone.
Need some help here for the 1st time speeding ticket?
Sunday morning 12:10am when I was going home from work I was doing bit speeding on Gardiner. I was going with about 130km/h. I know its fast. I always take the same way and I know where the cops hide. They always hide entrance of the highways. If I will do speeding I always look my back and did look this time too. I took gardiner Highway from spadina. It was good until Gardener end and DVP started soon as I took DVP I kept my speed about 120km/h. And there was a car going front of me slow and took his front. Soon as I did this I saw a car just appear from Gardiner to DVP. Distance was about 1km and there was a car between us. I knew he was a cop because of the front lights(yellow). He did not turn on his siren or lights. Distance was the same he went behind the car that I passed and I slowed down and took the midle line. Then once he saw me he speed it up and came behind me. He followed me 3.3km and exit from donmils N. Soon as exit from highway. He turn on his lights and pulled over. He came up and told me that I was speeding over 140km/h and I asked for driver license. I asked him if he wants insurance too. He said no 1st but then he said yes. He just looked at my insurance and gave it back. He didnt ask for owner ship. By the way car is my fathers and it was on his name. He took only my license and went his car. After 15 min he came up with 3 tickets. 1- speeding with over 49km which is 139km 2nd plate cover. 3rd plate sticker which I had but wasnt there but it was in owner ship which he didnt look at it. He said that He didnt give me over 50 but gave me 49 otherwise tow the car and suspend the license. Total fine about $600. Once he gave me the tickets I asked him did he catch me on radar he said yes, but I dont believe him. I think he entered the Gardener highway from jarves St and saw me going fast and followed me but we had the car between us. On the ticket he say he pulled me over DVP and DUNDAS ST (but there is no intersection like that) He pulled me DVP donmils N exit. His writing was not clear its really hard to read I believe he made couple of mistakes. Such as address wrong spelled and plate number. 641 is seems 611 or 6Y1 and etc. MY QUESTION IS HOW IMPORTAN COPS WRITING. IF ITS NOT CLEAR WHAT CAN JUDGE SAY[/img]
Last edited by king on Wed Feb 18, 2009 4:21 am, edited 1 time in total.
unless there is a violation at an intersection there does not have to be 2 roads listed on a ticket. Often a cross road is listed for info only as a cross reference where an offence took place, not necessarily where the vehicle was stopped. Validation: There are two stickers for proper validation. Both stickers have corresponding "serial numbers". 1) Not only does it have to be current, the sticker MUST be affixed to the "UPPER RIGHT HAND" corner of the plate. Black letter plates the sticker is on the front plate, blue lettered plates the sticker is on the rear plate. 2) The other validation sticker must be affixed to the back of the permit (ownership).
unless there is a violation at an intersection there does not have to be 2 roads listed on a ticket. Often a cross road is listed for info only as a cross reference where an offence took place, not necessarily where the vehicle was stopped.
Validation: There are two stickers for proper validation. Both stickers have corresponding "serial numbers". 1) Not only does it have to be current, the sticker MUST be affixed to the "UPPER RIGHT HAND" corner of the plate. Black letter plates the sticker is on the front plate, blue lettered plates the sticker is on the rear plate. 2) The other validation sticker must be affixed to the back of the permit (ownership).
Above is merely a suggestion/thought and in no way constitutes legal advice or views of my employer. www.OHTA.ca
I agree. Cops should need to show proof with the radar detector either the Genesis 2 or the Laser guns they have. They should have something to print them off computerized. It's one thing to estimate someones speed without a device simply by pacing or other cop techniques. Its quite another to fine someone based on that when the fine is a few hundred dollars. You better be pretty dam sure if your gonna charge someone with that.
I agree.
Cops should need to show proof with the radar detector either the Genesis 2 or the Laser guns they have. They should have something to print them off computerized.
It's one thing to estimate someones speed without a device simply by pacing or other cop techniques. Its quite another to fine someone based on that when the fine is a few hundred dollars.
You better be pretty dam sure if your gonna charge someone with that.
The ticket for no sticker can be dropped as soon as you show the proof of sticker purchase. However compounding it with other tickets makes things more complicated. It looks to me the cop did not have a clock on you, he knew you were speedy but he had no scientific evidence. So fight them, get disclosure and take it to court, he won't show up. If he shows up, grill him on the witness stand and make him lie to get conviction. It's tough time given the hard economic situation, everybody wants to keep his/her job, cops are all over the places in toronto in the pat year, not so much of finding the bad guys who broke into my car or broke into my apartment or recovering my stolen stuff but to hand out speeding tickets and stop sign tickets. They are the one i have to watch for, not the muggers
The ticket for no sticker can be dropped as soon as you show the proof of sticker purchase. However compounding it with other tickets makes things more complicated.
It looks to me the cop did not have a clock on you, he knew you were speedy but he had no scientific evidence.
So fight them, get disclosure and take it to court, he won't show up.
If he shows up, grill him on the witness stand and make him lie to get conviction.
It's tough time given the hard economic situation, everybody wants to keep his/her job, cops are all over the places in toronto in the pat year, not so much of finding the bad guys who broke into my car or broke into my apartment or recovering my stolen stuff but to hand out speeding tickets and stop sign tickets. They are the one i have to watch for, not the muggers
Last edited by liveontheedge on Mon Feb 16, 2009 11:38 am, edited 1 time in total.
I sat near a guy at the 1st attendance meeting at 1530 markham rd. he was charged for the same thing, he bought the sticker but had not put on the plate, the prosecutor or assisant prosecutor or whatever he was, signed off the ticket and told the guy the charge was dropped
I sat near a guy at the 1st attendance meeting at 1530 markham rd. he was charged for the same thing, he bought the sticker but had not put on the plate, the prosecutor or assisant prosecutor or whatever he was, signed off the ticket and told the guy the charge was dropped
The Prosecutors at the Provincial Offences Court on Markham Road tend to be fairly sympathetic, provided that you're honest and respectful. They tend to drop charges more readily than some other venues. Now about the ticket... After you've sent the ticket in with the trial option checked off, put together a disclosure request, including the officer's notes, and also request a copy of the radar manual. This will help you establish where the officer observed you, how he did it, etc., and allow you to put together a defence strategy. It is true that DVP and Dundas does not have an intersection, but Dundas Street has a bridge over the DVP, so that's good enough. The officer's poor handwriting is not sufficient to quash the charge. There must be an absolutely fatal error on the ticket, such as completely wrong location, missing date, missing signature, or something of that nature to get it thrown out. The Justice of the Peace will only amend the certificate or have it clarified unless it has a fatal error. Here's a very helpful website for more information: www.ticketcombat.com [/quote]
liveontheedge wrote:
I sat near a guy at the 1st attendance meeting at 1530 markham rd. he was charged for the same thing, he bought the sticker but had not put on the plate, the prosecutor or assisant prosecutor or whatever he was, signed off the ticket and told the guy the charge was dropped
The Prosecutors at the Provincial Offences Court on Markham Road tend to be fairly sympathetic, provided that you're honest and respectful. They tend to drop charges more readily than some other venues.
Now about the ticket... After you've sent the ticket in with the trial option checked off, put together a disclosure request, including the officer's notes, and also request a copy of the radar manual. This will help you establish where the officer observed you, how he did it, etc., and allow you to put together a defence strategy.
It is true that DVP and Dundas does not have an intersection, but Dundas Street has a bridge over the DVP, so that's good enough. The officer's poor handwriting is not sufficient to quash the charge. There must be an absolutely fatal error on the ticket, such as completely wrong location, missing date, missing signature, or something of that nature to get it thrown out. The Justice of the Peace will only amend the certificate or have it clarified unless it has a fatal error.
Here's a very helpful website for more information:
heard a story, not sure how true it is......defendant brings in copy of manual to ask questions, prosecutor asks for recess, and officer then brings his copy up onto the stand......defendant asked questions from manual, officer just looked up answers from the manual. Certainly makes the manual thing a waste of time......hmmm, maybe I should start carrying it.
Radar Identified wrote:
also request a copy of the radar manual
heard a story, not sure how true it is......defendant brings in copy of manual to ask questions, prosecutor asks for recess, and officer then brings his copy up onto the stand......defendant asked questions from manual, officer just looked up answers from the manual. Certainly makes the manual thing a waste of time......hmmm, maybe I should start carrying it.
Above is merely a suggestion/thought and in no way constitutes legal advice or views of my employer. www.OHTA.ca
I wish I could put my ticket on here and showed you guys so you could see it. Well on speeding ticket the last 2 digit of the plate nuber is so unreadble "641" seems like 6Y1 or 611. but It seems clear on other 2 tickets. The year of the vehicle is 2002 put he puted 09. as I said address is danforth ave but "rth" is like not even english letter. My driver licens start with "K" but it looks no way K. All the Ks are written in the same way. It looks like "I C" and exactly the way its written "rth". His "n" and "v" are the same style. When can I asked for DISCLOSURE REQUEST? and if I receive will I be able to see that if he caught me on radar or not.
I wish I could put my ticket on here and showed you guys so you could see it. Well on speeding ticket the last 2 digit of the plate nuber is so unreadble "641" seems like 6Y1 or 611. but It seems clear on other 2 tickets. The year of the vehicle is 2002 put he puted 09. as I said address is danforth ave but "rth" is like not even english letter. My driver licens start with "K" but it looks no way K. All the Ks are written in the same way. It looks like "I C" and exactly the way its written "rth". His "n" and "v" are the same style. When can I asked for DISCLOSURE REQUEST? and if I receive will I be able to see that if he caught me on radar or not.
You can scan/photograph the ticket(s), erase your personal info (we don't need to see that), and upload it/them to Imageshack. You can post the picture using either the BBcode provided by Imageshack, or the following: Code: Select all [IMG]http://www.somesite.com/yourimage.jpg[/IMG] 09 vs 02 - he looks at the validation sticker, so you cannot use that to bring down the tickets.
king wrote:
I wish I could put my ticket on here and showed you guys so you could see it. Well on speeding ticket the last 2 digit of the plate nuber is so unreadble "641" seems like 6Y1 or 611. but It seems clear on other 2 tickets. The year of the vehicle is 2002 put he puted 09. as I said address is danforth ave but "rth" is like not even english letter. My driver licens start with "K" but it looks no way K. All the Ks are written in the same way. It looks like "I C" and exactly the way its written "rth". His "n" and "v" are the same style. When can I asked for DISCLOSURE REQUEST? and if I receive will I be able to see that if he caught me on radar or not.
You can scan/photograph the ticket(s), erase your personal info (we don't need to see that), and upload it/them to Imageshack. You can post the picture using either the BBcode provided by Imageshack, or the following:
heard a story, not sure how true it is......defendant brings in copy of manual to ask questions, prosecutor asks for recess, and officer then brings his copy up onto the stand......defendant asked questions from manual, officer just looked up answers from the manual. Certainly makes the manual thing a waste of time......hmmm, maybe I should start carrying it. And my question would be, were you carrying the manual at the time of the incident???
hwybear wrote:
Radar Identified wrote:
also request a copy of the radar manual
heard a story, not sure how true it is......defendant brings in copy of manual to ask questions, prosecutor asks for recess, and officer then brings his copy up onto the stand......defendant asked questions from manual, officer just looked up answers from the manual. Certainly makes the manual thing a waste of time......hmmm, maybe I should start carrying it.
And my question would be, were you carrying the manual at the time of the incident???
http://www.OHTA.ca OR http://www.OntarioTrafficAct.com
Might be true. The main reasons for requesting the manual are so that the defendant can ask how it was used/tested and if that meets the manufacturer's operations, and to get the charge quashed for improper disclosure after the Prosecutor balks at handing it over. Other technical questions... not really important. But... Hmm... if the officer didn't demonstrate satisfactory knowledge of the device (proper use/testing, possible errors) and wasn't carrying the manual...
hwybear wrote:
heard a story, not sure how true it is......defendant brings in copy of manual to ask questions, prosecutor asks for recess, and officer then brings his copy up onto the stand......defendant asked questions from manual, officer just looked up answers from the manual.
Might be true. The main reasons for requesting the manual are so that the defendant can ask how it was used/tested and if that meets the manufacturer's operations, and to get the charge quashed for improper disclosure after the Prosecutor balks at handing it over. Other technical questions... not really important. But...
Reflections wrote:
And my question would be, were you carrying the manual at the time of the incident???
Hmm... if the officer didn't demonstrate satisfactory knowledge of the device (proper use/testing, possible errors) and wasn't carrying the manual...
I searched but could not retrieve a satisfactory answer.
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