Can I appeal?

Nouvelle_ange
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Can I appeal?

Unread post by Nouvelle_ange on

I recently had a court hearing. I managed to get the officer to explain the cosine effect and managed to prove how the cosine effect could have affected the radar reading. When making his ruling, the judge talked about his previous career as an engineer and how he thought that even with the cosine effect, the reading would be +/-1.

Was the judge allowed by the law to use his previous career or did he overstep? If he overstepped, can I appeal his ruling based on this?

Thanks!


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hwybear
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Unread post by hwybear on

As long as the JP understands the Cosine Effect don't think there is a problem. You might want to get a transcript from the court to confirm what you heard, review and then decide. IF there is an error, then you can appeal.

If your appeal is successful there will be another trial, and then it'll pretty much be a repeat trial and see if that JP understands the Cosine Error.......which is very simplistic and waste of time to bring up
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Radar measures the relative speed of an target approaching (or receding) the radar. If a target is traveling directly (collision course) at the radar, the relative speed is actual target speed. If the target is not traveling directly toward (or away) the radar but slightly off to avoid a collision, the relative speed with respect to the radar is slightly lower than target speed, thus always a lower speed displayed, in favour of the target. The phenomenon is called the Cosine Effect because the measured speed is directly related to the cosine of the angle.

Only time the cosine effect would show a higher reading than actual is in moving mode IF the radar antenna, was angled up at an extreme angle. This would actually give a lower patrol speed than indicated, and take that difference and add it onto the target vehicles speed. Hence, that is why when operating moving radar a mandatory requirement is to compare the patrol vehicle speedometer to the displayed patrol speed to ensure it is accurate, thus giving a true patrol speed, and this cosine effect is not possible.
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I tried to find a link for "reasons for appeal" or such, but unable to, sorry. Possible one of the other co-habits on here might have one.
Good luck!
Above is merely a suggestion/thought and in no way constitutes legal advice or views of my employer. www.OHTA.ca


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Reflections
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Unread post by Reflections on

I don't know the whole story here. But unless there was what "Bear explained present in your situation then you'll have no legal leg to stand on. Besides, the cosine effect, for the most part, works for you not against. I doubt that your appeal will succeed.

Can you explain the incident a little further???
http://www.OHTA.ca OR http://www.OntarioTrafficAct.com


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Bookm
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Unread post by Bookm on

I think this type of defense is used to dispute the speed listed on the ticket. You are challenging the listed speed alone, not trying to establish the "true" speed.

You are arguing that the Crown must prove the actual speed is what is written on the ticket, PERIOD.

Not sure if it will work... Lots of info here:
http://www.radardetector.net/forums/how ... ur-ticket/


Nouvelle_ange
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Unread post by Nouvelle_ange on

Huge thanks to everyone! Thanks for the link Bookm. For anyone who would like more details, this is what happened. The cop explained the Cosine Effect by saying that depending on the angle, the radar may show a faster reading or a slower reading than the real speed. He added that he thinks that the Cosine Effect did not apply in my case. He had said earlier that he was in the right lane and I was in the left lane when he took my reading. He said that his radar was on the left side of his vehicle and that he was 200 feet behind me when he took the reading. He said that based on that position, we were virtually on a collision line. I argued that the cop is trying to play with words by inventing a virtual collision line. In the end, when the judge was ruling, he said that the defendant brought up a defense based on the Cosine Effect. Then the judge said that he used to be an engineer and that from his engineering background, he knew that the Cosine Effect would have added a +/-1 error. After he found me guilty. I put up my hand. I asked that the record note that the judge used his prior experience as an engineer instead of simply relying on the evidence. The judge seemed taken aback and said that "Well, even if I did not use my background as an engineer, I would still have found you guilty. But the record is the record." His reaction made me feel that the law may not be on his side. My proceedings were on Friday afternoon. So, I wanted to get some feedback before I contact a lawyer this coming week.

Thanks a lot everyone for all the responses!






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