In some cases, it takes too long for the Crown to bring a charge against a defendant to trial. If your charge has taken too long to come to trial, you can stop the proceedings by "filing an 11B." This is filing paperwork to bring a motion at your trial, where you essentially say, "my rights to a speedy trial have been violated, and I want the case stopped." It is called an 11B because section 11B of the Charter of Rights and Freedoms guarantees you the right to a speedy trial. You can't just show up in court and say "this took too long to come to trial." You MUST file the paperwork. There is a lot of good, useful information out there about how to file an 11B. Generally, it must have been at least 11 months between the time you filed your ticket with the courthouse and the proceeding of trial. Keep in mind, though, the delays have to be attributable to the Crown. If you had a trial scheduled at 8 months, and then asked for a re-schedule because you were sick and the new time was 12 months after the ticket was filed, that is only considered "8 months." If, though, you asked for disclosure, and they didn't have it ready, that delay is "attributable to the Crown," and then it would be "12 months." In other words, you can't just keep asking for adjournments until it goes over 11 months and then file an 11B (unless it's the Crown's fault, e.g. no disclosure). You can file an 11B yourself, or you can hire a paralegal to do it for you. They both have their pros and cons, so you need to decide what is right for you. Be forewarned that filing this yourself requires a lot of work, and you still have to be prepared to present an argument in court. If you choose to file the 11B yourself, you'll need to do the following to get started: - Find your ticket - Find Notice of Trial - Gather any other court records (e.g. transcripts if you had a date in court already, etc) - Locate a Commissioner of Oaths or Notary Public Then the fun begins. You have to determine if you have a reasonable case for delay of trial. We already discussed the time line above. That comes from two precedent-setting cases, R. v. Askov and R. v. Morin cases. You should review them. Yes, it is a lot of reading! This website has some good information on how to put the paperwork together: http://fightyourtickets.ca/tickets/appl ... oceedings/ Some threads cover this extensively, such as this one: http://www.ontariohighwaytrafficact.com/topic2808.html diehard, in the post below, covers the steps to follow. Keep in mind that the clerks have very little training and sometimes you need to guide them, step-by-step, through what you are doing. For example, when I had to file the Affidavits of Service, it took almost eight minutes of going back and forth with the clerk before finally a Supervisor stepped in, stamped the forms and said "okay you're good to go." Just be patient. Stand your ground, but be patient, when filing. The exception to the filing process mentioned by diehard is the suffocating, depressing nightmare you will encounter at Old City Hall in Toronto. For a quick guide to that, please see this website: http://www.ticketcombat.com/step4/howtofile_harder.php You need to serve the following parties with the 11B application at least 15 days (preferably 20+ days) prior to your court date: - Attorney-General of Canada - Attorney-General of Ontario - Prosecutor's Office handling your case - Court where your case will be heard You need proof that you have served each party with the application. The Attorneys-General can be served by fax; you will need to retain the fax receipts and also swear an Affidavit of Service (form 16B) that you served them. The Prosecutor's Office and Court should be served in person. For details on how to do this, please see diehard's post below.
Unfortunately, you can not give the prosecutor's office a generic list; you have to be specific. Generally for speeding you can only ask for the officer's notes and a copy of the speed measuring device's manual: http://www.ontariohighwaytrafficact.com/topic2959.html Prosecutor's office can ignore long-winded requests and force defendants to explain to the JP how each and every individual request item is relevant to their charge. If the courts believe your disclosure request is a fishing expedition, and you're overwhelming the prosecution with frivolous items then this can backfire on you. S7 charter challenge would not be entertained, and future adjournments will count against you and not the crown.
Unfortunately, you can not give the prosecutor's office a generic list; you have to be specific. Generally for speeding you can only ask for the officer's notes and a copy of the speed measuring device's manual: http://www.ontariohighwaytrafficact.com/topic2959.html
Prosecutor's office can ignore long-winded requests and force defendants to explain to the JP how each and every individual request item is relevant to their charge.
If the courts believe your disclosure request is a fishing expedition, and you're overwhelming the prosecution with frivolous items then this can backfire on you.
S7 charter challenge would not be entertained, and future adjournments will count against you and not the crown.
All I got last time was officers notes, cpic report, radar manual. I understand that's all they probably have, but at this time 2 requests have gone unanswered.
iFly55 wrote:
Unfortunately, you can not give the prosecutor's office a generic list; you have to be specific. Generally for speeding you can only ask for the officer's notes and a copy of the speed measuring device's manual: http://www.ontariohighwaytrafficact.com/topic2959.html
Prosecutor's office can ignore long-winded requests and force defendants to explain to the JP how each and every individual request item is relevant to their charge.
If the courts believe your disclosure request is a fishing expedition, and you're overwhelming the prosecution with frivolous items then this can backfire on you.
S7 charter challenge would not be entertained, and future adjournments will count against you and not the crown.
All I got last time was officers notes, cpic report, radar manual. I understand that's all they probably have, but at this time 2 requests have gone unanswered.
Hello I am getting ready to file a 4F under section 7 and 11b. Here is my case. Charged on Oct 30th, 2013 with going 87 in 60, charged dropped to 75 in 60 roadside. I requested a meeting with the prosecutor thinking they will drop the charge (bad thinking), they did not, so notice of trial was sent to me on Jan 8th for june 18th 2014. I requested disclosure twice, they sent me nothing, so I filed a 4F for non-dsiclosure. I argued my 4F but the justice only granted an adjournment for Nov 12th 2014. I checked the disclosure they gave me and it was missing some of the items I requested. I again requested disclosure of the missing items twice without any answer. My trial will be 12 months and 13 days from the time of charge and 10 months and 4 days since my early resolution meeting. I also requested an early trial date through a letter I sent, but they left a voicemail saying the date I requested is not available and that I have to appear before a judge to change the trial date) My question is, do I use the same 4F for both section & argument and 11B? Or do I send 2 forms for each argument? Please advise, as I need to file the paperwork by this friday October 10th. Thank you
Hello
I am getting ready to file a 4F under section 7 and 11b.
Here is my case. Charged on Oct 30th, 2013 with going 87 in 60, charged dropped to 75 in 60 roadside. I requested a meeting with the prosecutor thinking they will drop the charge (bad thinking), they did not, so notice of trial was sent to me on Jan 8th for june 18th 2014. I requested disclosure twice, they sent me nothing, so I filed a 4F for non-dsiclosure. I argued my 4F but the justice only granted an adjournment for Nov 12th 2014. I checked the disclosure they gave me and it was missing some of the items I requested. I again requested disclosure of the missing items twice without any answer. My trial will be 12 months and 13 days from the time of charge and 10 months and 4 days since my early resolution meeting. I also requested an early trial date through a letter I sent, but they left a voicemail saying the date I requested is not available and that I have to appear before a judge to change the trial date)
My question is, do I use the same 4F for both section & argument and 11B? Or do I send 2 forms for each argument?
Please advise, as I need to file the paperwork by this friday October 10th.
All I got last time was officers notes, cpic report, radar manual. I understand that's all they probably have, but at this time 2 requests have gone unanswered. They sent me a letter saying they don't mail disclosure (BS) and I could get it emailed, faxed or picked up. I called the number and requested it be emailed then as I don't have time to attend; I'm away with work all the time.
Millstone wrote:
iFly55 wrote:
Unfortunately, you can not give the prosecutor's office a generic list; you have to be specific. Generally for speeding you can only ask for the officer's notes and a copy of the speed measuring device's manual: http://www.ontariohighwaytrafficact.com/topic2959.html
Prosecutor's office can ignore long-winded requests and force defendants to explain to the JP how each and every individual request item is relevant to their charge.
If the courts believe your disclosure request is a fishing expedition, and you're overwhelming the prosecution with frivolous items then this can backfire on you.
S7 charter challenge would not be entertained, and future adjournments will count against you and not the crown.
All I got last time was officers notes, cpic report, radar manual. I understand that's all they probably have, but at this time 2 requests have gone unanswered.
They sent me a letter saying they don't mail disclosure (BS) and I could get it emailed, faxed or picked up. I called the number and requested it be emailed then as I don't have time to attend; I'm away with work all the time.
Looking at different guides, i am confused about which forms must be submitted for 11b application. Do i have to create 6 binders based on this sample: http://scopezoom.com/11b/StayPDF.pdf or is 4 copies of FORM 4F (1 page) completed enough? Confused...
Looking at different guides, i am confused about which forms must be submitted for 11b application. Do i have to create 6 binders based on this sample: http://scopezoom.com/11b/StayPDF.pdf
or is 4 copies of FORM 4F (1 page) completed enough?
Hi all, Great information on this site. It's been very helpful. Does anyone still have a copy of StayPDF.pdf?? It appears the original document was on scopezoom.com and the site appears to be down. Any help would be greatly appreciated, and I'd be happy to update my experience here with the latest info on the procedures. Thanks again!
Hi all,
Great information on this site. It's been very helpful.
Does anyone still have a copy of StayPDF.pdf??
It appears the original document was on scopezoom.com and the site appears to be down.
Any help would be greatly appreciated, and I'd be happy to update my experience here with the latest info on the procedures.
I will be going to trial for my red light camera offence.
I'll be arguing two issues, centered on the fact that there are two essential elements of 144(18) - a) a vehicle approaching the intersection shall stop; and b) the vehicle shall not proceed until green. Both essential elements must be contravened beyond a reasonable doubt to be an offence.
1) My ticket says I (being the owner) am "charged…
I know that the RIDE program has been covered extensively in these great forums, but I have a question about the stop itself:
I recently was stopped for a RIDE Program and the officer asked me to roll the window down all of the way (I had it at half and could easily communicate with them). I told them that I could hear them just fine and they insisted I roll it down all of the way. Again I told…
Not sure the right place for this so if it needs to be moved please do so.
I was stopped today for 15 over the speed limit, I gave all the documents to the officer and he said he could not accept a photocopy of my ownership only the original I had a photo copy front and back and I had my plate sticker number with it.
he gave me a ticket for HWY ACT Section 7(5)(a) he said only the original would…
Hey! I'm from Sudbury Ontario. Hope that general talk is fine for this subject
I am very serious about looking for exact ruling about underfacing lighting
Section 14 clearly states:
Red and blue lights to the front restricted
(14.1) In addition to the lighting requirements in this Part, a police department vehicle may carry lamps that cast red and blue lights, but no other motor vehicle shall carry…
i was driving my dad's car when i was caught by the red light camera in Brampton. My dad would've to take time off work to go ask for a trial and then go to one.
Can i represent him? if yes, what do i need to do?
I was pulled over and told I went through a red light during a right turn. I learned through a friend who is a police constable that the one who pulled me over is new to the job (under a year, and possibly even the first month or two of real duty).
I was given a ticket for $180. I have some questions:
(1) Is this offense automatically associated with 3 demerit points? I see no mention of them on…
I got a ticket for 'Disobey Stop Sign' in November of 2013 (in York Region), requested disclosure and went to court in August of 2014. At my first appearance, I did not plea but requested an ajournment to to consult legal advice. The JOP set the next appearance in September.
I contacted a paralegal about my options. He told me that on my next appearance, if the police officer did not show, the…
I had a trial and found guilty, but the trial seemed to go wrong since the beginning.
The JP asked me if i am intending to take the stand- I said NO.
I asked how to submit my evidence-documents and photos.
JP said-i have to take the stand if i want to submit evidence.(Now i am finding this is wrong-i could introduce my evidence during cross examination and my defense would be much stronger)
Ottawa, Canada (AHN) - Beginning Tuesday, or April Fool's Day 2008, fines on Quebec drivers caught overspeeding will be doubled. It is not only the money penalty that will go up, but also demerit points.
The new law, Bill 42, is similar to Ontario's street racing rule. It stipulates fines for motorists who drive at over 40 km/h at under 60 km/h zones, speed at 50 km/h at 60 to 90 km/h areas and…
Make big trucks go slower and the roads will become safer.
Obvious, isn't it? It's also obvious when you look out the window that the world is flat.
Last Monday, truckers in Ontario tried to mount a convoy to Queen's Park to show their opposition to electronic speed limiters. These devices, electronic chips in trucks' engine management systems, restrict speeds…
I was out on a four lane highway around Orangeville Ontario and I noticed a school bus coming south (I was going north). I kept my eyes on the bus in case it was going to stop. As I approached it, it was slowing down a little, but no lights, and especially no arm with the STOP sign. As I was just about to pass the bus, I still did not see the lights, nor did I see the STOP sign.
Hey everyone first off I'd like to say great website, I have been reading and it is very useful
I'm posting today as I'd like to get some feedback on my situation and have a couple of questions. Please excuse the vagueness in some areas - I don't want my case to be identifiable given the small town.
So I was driving up north and was pulled over by an OPP SUV for doing 31 over. Cop drove past me,…
Driving on a 80km/hr highway the car ahead hits the brakes and slows to 55, l slow down right behind him no reason to slow down traffic was moving between 80 and 90. I notice the driver is on the phone and looking through papers on the passenger seat. He begins to start to go a opp officer drives by doing 80 plus in oncoming lane turns around and says l was following to close. Told him what was…
My son was making a right turn at the intersection he had a green so slowed down looked and proceeded into the turn. It was pouring rain and the was a big pool of water as he got arround the curb. He tried to keep the car going sharp right however it slid into the car making a left turn. the lane he was turning into is very narrow and at a very busy corner. He paniced and left the scene only…
I had an collision the other day. I was turing left and ran into a car going straight in the opposite direction. The insurance company has already determined that I'm at fault, since I made the left turn. But I'm wondering whether I should go on trail and at least I might get rid of the ticket. The ticket was under 142(1)
I was told that if I go on court, both the guy I hit and the officer who…
question for a friend of mine.....says she got a 3 day suspension for giving a A on a roadside. Thing is she wasnt driving. She is a g2 driver and the car was parked in a parking lot, she just ran out to get something and turned the car on. Can a 3 day be issued if you arent driving on a highway - (I've read for impaired it doesnt matter, but 3 day isnt criminal)? And is there any way to…
I can't find the category for this post so I'm posting it here.
Two questions...
1. Are golf carts considered a 'vehicle' under the Highway traffic act? I know carts can't drive across roads or on roads but if you try to bring one from the USA into Canada they are considered a 'vehicle'.
2. If you are on private property are you allowed to carry 'opened' alcohol in your golf cart? I know golf…
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I was driving westbound on Hwy. 8 earlier this month in North Dumfries Township, approaching the Cambridge city limits. The weather was clear and the roads were dry. I noticed a vehicle on the shoulder on my side of the road, pointing towards me. This didn't concern me right away, as it is a rural area and I sometimes see vehicles doing mail delivery. The vehicle then started accelerating and…
I was pulled over yesterday in a community safety zone and told I was doing 84 in a 50. When i passed the officer I looked at my odometer and I was only doing 64. I was given a summons on the spot to appear in court at the end of June. Do I have any chance in this if it comes down to his word over mine. I was in the car alone but have travelled these same roads every day, twice a day for 6 years…
who is at fault when :a) a passenger opens door and jumps out of vehicle onto the road with traffic. b) he gets hit by a car travelling in the adjoining lane. c) traffic lights were green. d) pedestrian crossing was further up and indicated "no crossing" light e) the vehicle that he exited from leaves the scene as soon as accident occurred. f) no charges have been laid after police filed report…
Re: How to file an 11B
