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How to file an 11B
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 12, 2010 7:16 pm 
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In some cases, it takes too long for the Crown to bring a charge against a defendant to trial. If your charge has taken too long to come to trial, you can stop the proceedings by "filing an 11B." This is filing paperwork to bring a motion at your trial, where you essentially say, "my rights to a speedy trial have been violated, and I want the case stopped." It is called an 11B because section 11B of the Charter of Rights and Freedoms guarantees you the right to a speedy trial. You can't just show up in court and say "this took too long to come to trial." You MUST file the paperwork.

There is a lot of good, useful information out there about how to file an 11B. Generally, it must have been at least 11 months between the time you filed your ticket with the courthouse and the proceeding of trial. Keep in mind, though, the delays have to be attributable to the Crown. If you had a trial scheduled at 8 months, and then asked for a re-schedule because you were sick and the new time was 12 months after the ticket was filed, that is only considered "8 months." If, though, you asked for disclosure, and they didn't have it ready, that delay is "attributable to the Crown," and then it would be "12 months." In other words, you can't just keep asking for adjournments until it goes over 11 months and then file an 11B (unless it's the Crown's fault, e.g. no disclosure).

You can file an 11B yourself, or you can hire a paralegal to do it for you. They both have their pros and cons, so you need to decide what is right for you. Be forewarned that filing this yourself requires a lot of work, and you still have to be prepared to present an argument in court.

If you choose to file the 11B yourself, you'll need to do the following to get started:

- Find your ticket
- Find Notice of Trial
- Gather any other court records (e.g. transcripts if you had a date in court already, etc)
- Locate a Commissioner of Oaths or Notary Public

Then the fun begins. You have to determine if you have a reasonable case for delay of trial. We already discussed the time line above. That comes from two precedent-setting cases, R. v. Askov and R. v. Morin cases. You should review them. Yes, it is a lot of reading!

This website has some good information on how to put the paperwork together:

http://fightyourtickets.ca/tickets/appl ... oceedings/

Some threads cover this extensively, such as this one:

topic2808.html

diehard, in the post below, covers the steps to follow. Keep in mind that the clerks have very little training and sometimes you need to guide them, step-by-step, through what you are doing. For example, when I had to file the Affidavits of Service, it took almost eight minutes of going back and forth with the clerk before finally a Supervisor stepped in, stamped the forms and said "okay you're good to go." Just be patient. Stand your ground, but be patient, when filing. The exception to the filing process mentioned by diehard is the suffocating, depressing nightmare you will encounter at Old City Hall in Toronto. For a quick guide to that, please see this website:

http://www.ticketcombat.com/step4/howtofile_harder.php

You need to serve the following parties with the 11B application at least 15 days (preferably 20+ days) prior to your court date:

- Attorney-General of Canada
- Attorney-General of Ontario
- Prosecutor's Office handling your case
- Court where your case will be heard

You need proof that you have served each party with the application. The Attorneys-General can be served by fax; you will need to retain the fax receipts and also swear an Affidavit of Service (form 16B) that you served them. The Prosecutor's Office and Court should be served in person. For details on how to do this, please see diehard's post below.

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* The above is NOT legal advice. By acting on anything I have said, you assume responsibility for any outcome and consequences. *
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Re: How to file an 11B
PostPosted: Thu Dec 16, 2010 3:53 pm 
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This quick and simplified guide describes how to file an 11b.

Got my ticket in mid November of 2009 and the trial date was set for end of December of 2010, so that’s more than 13 months.

After weeks of reading TicketCombat.com and discussion forums, I was still confused because of the many form names and the sequences described weren't clear enough in some points.

Anyway, I successfully submitted my application.

These are the two and only forms you will need

- Notice of Application for Stay of Proceedings (http://scopezoom.com/11b/StayPDF.pdf)
- 16B Affidavit of Service (attached)

Modify tabs 1 to 4 of the Notice of Application according to your case.

Tabs 5 and 6 are simply copies of the first pages of the Ashkov and Morin trials.
In my notice of application:
Tab 5 had the first 6 pages of the Ahkov Trial
Tab 6 had the first 8 pages of the Morin Trial
Both cases are in the attached zip file.


I printed four copies of the Notice of Application, and had two of them bind in Staples (with nice covers and tabs).

I finally headed to the Toronto East Court Office (1530 Markham Road) to submit my application.

1. Go to Ticket Office (sardine room).
2. Get into the big line to pick a number. Tell clerk that you are “filing an 11b”.
3. He will give you a number, beginning with the letter O for “Other”.
4. Wait, wait and wait until you are called
5. Tell clerk that you would like your 4 copies of the Notice of Application sworn by a commissioner of oaths. (see screenshot below)
6. If the clerk is a commissioner of oaths, then she will do that (most are). Otherwise she will call someone who is. Have a photo ID with you.
7. Go to Prosecutors office to serve them.
8. They will stamp the four copies and keep one.
9. Now it’s time to serve the Attorney General of Ontario and Attorney General of Canada
10. Go to a fax machine. (Beware Staple charges $1.5 per page for long distance!)
11. Fax notice of application to Attorney General of Ontario
12. Fax notice of application to Attorney General of Canada
13. Keep fax receipts!
14. Now it’s time to fill out four 16B Affidavit of Services, two for each Attorney. (see attached sample)
15. Go back to Ticket Office (sardine room).
16. Get into the big line to pick a new number. Tell clerk you’re “filing an 11b”. You’ll get another “O” number.
17. Wait, wait and wait…
18. Tell clerk that you are serving the court. Show her the three Notices that you have.
19. She will stamp the three copies of the Notice of Application and keep one. The Court has been served.
20. Ask her you’d like to have the 4 copies of the 16B Affidavit of Services sworn.
21. This step is important because you are swearing and proving that you have served the Attorney General of Ontario and Attorney General of Canada.
21. She will keep two copies with fax receipts and you’ll keep the other two.

You’re done.

A few comments:
When asking for a number and saying you’re “filing an 11b”, do not argue with clerk. Just show the Notice of Applications and politely ask for an “O” number. (“O” for Other);

After you’re finished you’ll have in hands the following:
Two copies of the Notice of Application sworn and stamped by the Court and Prosecutor.
Two 16B Affidavits of Service sworn by a commissioner of oaths, proving that you have served the Attorneys-General of Ontario and Canada


Now you must prepare for the main battle when the trial date arrives!


Faxes of the Attorneys-General

http://www.ei.gc.ca/eng/umpire/attorney_general.shtml

Attorney General of Canada
284 Wellington St.
Ottawa, ON K1A 0H8
613-992-4621
Fax: 613-990-7255

Attorney General of Ontario
720 Bay St., 11th Floor
Toronto, ON M5G 2K1
416-326-2220 or 1-800-518-7901
Fax: 416-326-4007



Screenshot of last page of sworn statement, tab 2

Image


Attachments:
16b-sample-attorney general of canada.zip [9.82 KiB]
Downloaded 1223 times
ashkov-and-morin.zip [203.39 KiB]
Downloaded 812 times
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Re: How to file an 11B
PostPosted: Tue Dec 28, 2010 11:42 pm 
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Just wanted to give every one a heads up, the number listed on the sample 16b form is wrong, that is the phone number for the Attorney General of Canada, not the fax number.
So when you go ahead and use it, you should correct it before filing it or it could throw a monkey wrench in your proceedings if the prosecutor picks up on it.

Cheers


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Re: How to file an 11B
PostPosted: Wed Dec 29, 2010 8:37 am 
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Yes, the phone number on the attached 16b affidavit sample is incorrect.

But that file is just a sample. It's the user's responsibility to check all info.

The fax numbers are listed on the bottom of my quick guide, and users should awal


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Re: How to file an 11B
PostPosted: Wed Dec 29, 2010 11:47 pm 
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diehard wrote:
Yes, the phone number on the attached 16b affidavit sample is incorrect.

But that file is just a sample. It's the user's responsibility to check all info.

The fax numbers are listed on the bottom of my quick guide, and users should awal


So very true, I was not trying to criticise or anything, I was simply trying to give people a heads up, in case if they did not pay close attention ;)

Lets face it, this is a great site and any one should be great full for the amount f information and help available on here...

Off to my next post which I may have to start a new thread...


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Re: How to file an 11B
PostPosted: Thu Dec 30, 2010 12:39 am 
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Joined: Tue Nov 13, 2007 5:04 pm
Posts: 995
Location: Ontario, Canada
Observer135 wrote:
Just wanted to give every one a heads up, the number listed on the sample 16b form is wrong, that is the phone number for the Attorney General of Canada, not the fax number.
So when you go ahead and use it, you should correct it before filing it or it could throw a monkey wrench in your proceedings if the prosecutor picks up on it.

Cheers


Thanks for pointing that out!

@DieHard - Great post! Thanks for sharing.

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Re: How to file an 11B
PostPosted: Wed Mar 02, 2011 4:31 pm 
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Hello, thanks for all these great documents. If you are filing for a section 11B these documents give great information if your traffic court is in Toronto, but what if its in York Region - say in Newmarket? Do you still have to deliver all these documents to the Toronto locations? If not, how does one go about finding the proper offices in their Town?

Thanks.


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Re: How to file an 11B
PostPosted: Wed Mar 02, 2011 9:35 pm 
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The Attorneys-General can be served via fax, so there is no need to make the trip to Toronto or Ottawa. However, the Prosecutor's Office at the court where your trial is being held must be served. So that must be filed with them. Likewise, the court where the trial will take place must also be served directly. You would serve the Prosecutor's Office in Newmarket, and then after you have your Affidavits of Service for the Attorneys-General, and proof that you've served the Prosecutor, you would then serve the court in Newmarket.

_________________
* The above is NOT legal advice. By acting on anything I have said, you assume responsibility for any outcome and consequences. *
http://www.OntarioTicket.com OR http://www.OHTA.ca


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Re: How to file an 11B
PostPosted: Wed Mar 09, 2011 11:45 pm 
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Thanks Radar Identified - but how can we fax such a large document? More-over do we not need their stamp on all other copies of the 11B? I've made 6 copies following the guidelines on this thread, but the books are so large I dont see how we could fax it or get them to stamp all our other copies.

These are the guidelines i've been following:
Quote:
The main points to remember are to:

1. Write your application for stay of proceeding and put it together as a document, which will serve as a motion for the constitutional question. Make six (6) copies and as you drop each one off (or have someone assist you in this regard) Ensure that you get all the applications stamped, and leave one with that person who stamped your application. The example I will use is in Toronto. I have prepared and signed off one application for stay of proceeding and I have made five (5) additional copies of it.

2. Serve it at the very latest, 15 days prior to the day that your trial is scheduled, to the Attorney General of Canada, Attorney General of Ontario, the Prosecutor at the Provincial Court where your trial is scheduled and to the Justice of the Peace, at the office where you applied for a court date to fight your ticket.

3. This is the method that you use while serving the application for stay document:
Make six (6) copies In Toronto, as an example, you would bring all six (6) copies of the application to the following

Places:
1. Department of Justice (Canada) (Ontario Regional Office) To serve the Attorney General of Canada Exchange Tower – located on 130 King St (just east of York St-on north side of King) Suite 3400, P.O. Box 36, Toronto, Ontario M5X 1K6 Go into elevator which travels to the 34th floor and get off with your six (6) copies and aks the receptionist to stamp all six (6) copies and leave him/her with one.The stamp will say “Service of a True Copy Admitted On – with the date” same as Ontario’s Attorney General.

2. Now you have five (5) stamped copies and next you go to the Attorney General of Ontario They are located at 720 Bay Street (west side of Bay, north of Gerrard St.) in a building called the McMurtry-Scott building (named after two former Attorneys General of Ontario) The Attorney General is located on the 11th floor, but you will never get there, it is on constant “lock-down”. You have to go to the phone in the corner of the lobby and phone and ask for a clerk from the “Constitutional branch” to come down and stamp your “Constitutional challenge”. Wait someone will come down, have them stamp the other 5 documents and provide the clerk with one. Now you have four.

3. Next stop is the Ontario Court of Justice office, Provincial Offences Act – Toronto South Office located on the second floor of 137 Edward St (just east of University, 1 street north of Dundas St. W). You have 4 stamped copies of the application for stay. You drop one off here for the Justice of the Peace. Have the clerk stamp them all four, and take away three.

4. Last but not least – Old City Hall – 60 Queen St. W at the Prosecutions Office in the basement – room E 12. Take you last three copies, have the clerk stamp them all and leave one and take away two copies. You may need both on the day of your trial and may end up sharing them with the Prosecutor and/or Justice of the Peace.


So you can see from the directions we are to make 6 books and have them stamped by each office as proof that they've been served. Could you please clarify how this could be accomplished via fax? Thanks for your assistance.


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Re: How to file an 11B
PostPosted: Thu Mar 10, 2011 2:23 pm 
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clyrrad wrote:
Thanks Radar Identified - but how can we fax such a large document? More-over do we not need their stamp on all other copies of the 11B? I've made 6 copies following the guidelines on this thread, but the books are so large I dont see how we could fax it or get them to stamp all our other copies.

So you can see from the directions we are to make 6 books and have them stamped by each office as proof that they've been served. Could you please clarify how this could be accomplished via fax? Thanks for your assistance.


Don't worry. In my case I printed only 4 copies.
Just follow closely the steps I describe above and you should be ok.
I used my work office's fax machine, couldn't afford the almost 1 dollar per page that Staples charges.
Yes, I faxed all pages of my application twice: one to the Attorney-General of Ontario and once more to the Attorney-General of Canada.


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Re: How to file an 11B
PostPosted: Sun Mar 13, 2011 9:30 pm 
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Thanks diehard - but I guess my question would be - how do you prove they got the fax? What if they say the fax was never received? How do we prove they got the fax without having their stamp on each book?

PS: The books are already printed and we paid Staples to Bind them so dont really mind so much having to get the stamp, but it sucks that the only options are Ottawa or Toronto??


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Re: How to file an 11B
PostPosted: Mon Mar 14, 2011 3:04 pm 
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clyrrad wrote:
Thanks diehard - but I guess my question would be - how do you prove they got the fax? What if they say the fax was never received? How do we prove they got the fax without having their stamp on each book?

PS: The books are already printed and we paid Staples to Bind them so dont really mind so much having to get the stamp, but it sucks that the only options are Ottawa or Toronto??


The stamp for the Attorneys-General is not essential.

But you must keep the fax receipts, that is very important to prove that they have been served.


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Re: How to file an 11B
PostPosted: Mon Mar 14, 2011 5:00 pm 
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Thanks for your feedback much appreciated :D


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Re: How to file an 11B
PostPosted: Sat Mar 19, 2011 5:11 pm 
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Sorry I forgot one last question. Once you have all the books stamped and everyone is served - where do we go from there?

How do we find out if the 11B is accepted or not? Do we just wait until trial? From what i've read an 11B is a "pre-trial" matter which needs to be addressed before the trial actually starts. So if this is correct - where do we go to find out if the 11B is accepted? Who do we talk to once all the books are stamped and everyone is served?

Thanks again for your help.


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Re: How to file an 11B
PostPosted: Mon Mar 21, 2011 10:07 pm 
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Hi Guys,

Ok today all 6 books were stamped by all the necessary parties - I still however can not find any good information on what to do from here. I've reviewed these forums and ticketcombat.com (excellent resources and have been very hepful) - however I cant find any good information on what to do / expect from here.

Now that everyone has been served, how does one find out if the 11B is accepted or not? Is this something you have to argue for on the date of your trial or does your sworn statement and documents included in your 11B application do the job for you?

I am trying to figure out what to expect from here and what will happen on the trial date. Can someone PRETTY PLEASE shed some light on this? I've been scouring the Internet and Forums and I can not find a answer to this question - I really need to know whats next.

What will happen from here? What should I expect at Trial? I read some information that you are not supposed to enter a plea but to tell the court that you have an 11B application pending - if that's the case - what happens? Does the court send you a letter letting you know if your 11B is accepted?

PS: I would like to open a detailed thread about how I did the 11B application since I was given a bit of a different run around from each office - but also because I learned alto and would like to contribute back to these forums for the info I have taken, but I need to know what to do / prepare from here.

:?: Hoping someone can help me out and answer this question. :?:


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