Hi all, I'm new to this but would really appreciate any help I can get. I was going SB on the 404 South of Finch Avenue, and stuck in rush hour traffic. I was late to work, so decided to cross the white line marking the lanes to take the exit onto Sheppard Ave. However, the cop pulled me over as I failed to stay in the marked lane. Couple of questions: a) I got a $110 ticket but want to fight it as I'm sure my insurance will go up if I'm convicted of an offence under the Highway Traffic Act. However, she let me off easy by not giving me any demerit points as I was honest about being late to work and making the unsafe lane change. Just wondering though, if I go to court to fight this - can they still increase my ticket to give me the three demerit points anyways? b) Is it worth fighting or should I just plead guilty and accept it? Should I ask for a disclosure of the officer's notes to challenge the evidence. I fully admit I was in the wrong so not sure if going to court will do anything besides reducing my ticket. As well, if I go to court - wont I have to pay court fees and what not... Any advice would be really appreciated - I'm a little nervous about going to court as I havent done it before so think any help would be beneficial! THANKS!
Hi all,
I'm new to this but would really appreciate any help I can get.
I was going SB on the 404 South of Finch Avenue, and stuck in rush hour traffic. I was late to work, so decided to cross the white line marking the lanes to take the exit onto Sheppard Ave. However, the cop pulled me over as I failed to stay in the marked lane.
Couple of questions:
a) I got a $110 ticket but want to fight it as I'm sure my insurance will go up if I'm convicted of an offence under the Highway Traffic Act. However, she let me off easy by not giving me any demerit points as I was honest about being late to work and making the unsafe lane change. Just wondering though, if I go to court to fight this - can they still increase my ticket to give me the three demerit points anyways?
b) Is it worth fighting or should I just plead guilty and accept it? Should I ask for a disclosure of the officer's notes to challenge the evidence. I fully admit I was in the wrong so not sure if going to court will do anything besides reducing my ticket. As well, if I go to court - wont I have to pay court fees and what not...
Any advice would be really appreciated - I'm a little nervous about going to court as I havent done it before so think any help would be beneficial!
Problem is, the officer does not have discretion as to whether or not to apply demerit points. In your case, a conviction under section 154 (c) of the Highway Traffic Act would result in 3 demerit points. The courts actually don't have the power to change that, either. When you get convicted of any driving infraction, it goes to MTO. If the offence is supposed to have demerit points, MTO will apply them to your record. The courts can give you a lower fine (even as low as $1), etc., but there is nothing they can do about demerit points, unfortunately. By fighting it, you are given more options. For example, you would have the option of plea-bargaining to something without demerit points. or, if the officer does not show up for trial, most of the time in Toronto they simply drop the charge. (That's about a 50-50 chance here.) If nothing else, at least the conviction stays off your insurance and driving record until 8-10 months down the road (at least). The court fee is $5, already included on your ticket. And yes, I'd suggest obtaining disclosure. As for going to court - it's not that bad. When you go to file the ticket with the trial option and Notice to Appear filled out, you can stop and observe a trial or two for free, just to get familiar with the process. Just a heads-up... it can be up to a 2-hour wait to file the paperwork. BUT, if you show up with the ticket and your Notice to Appear already filled out (it's available on the City of Toronto website), the clerk that is handing out numbers will sometimes take your paperwork, stamp it and file it for you. (I was in and out in 10 minutes while everyone else was waiting 2+ hours.) Keep us posted on what you decide to do.
Problem is, the officer does not have discretion as to whether or not to apply demerit points. In your case, a conviction under section 154 (c) of the Highway Traffic Act would result in 3 demerit points. The courts actually don't have the power to change that, either. When you get convicted of any driving infraction, it goes to MTO. If the offence is supposed to have demerit points, MTO will apply them to your record. The courts can give you a lower fine (even as low as $1), etc., but there is nothing they can do about demerit points, unfortunately.
By fighting it, you are given more options. For example, you would have the option of plea-bargaining to something without demerit points. or, if the officer does not show up for trial, most of the time in Toronto they simply drop the charge. (That's about a 50-50 chance here.) If nothing else, at least the conviction stays off your insurance and driving record until 8-10 months down the road (at least). The court fee is $5, already included on your ticket. And yes, I'd suggest obtaining disclosure.
As for going to court - it's not that bad. When you go to file the ticket with the trial option and Notice to Appear filled out, you can stop and observe a trial or two for free, just to get familiar with the process.
Just a heads-up... it can be up to a 2-hour wait to file the paperwork. BUT, if you show up with the ticket and your Notice to Appear already filled out (it's available on the City of Toronto website), the clerk that is handing out numbers will sometimes take your paperwork, stamp it and file it for you. (I was in and out in 10 minutes while everyone else was waiting 2+ hours.)
Keep us posted on what you decide to do.
* The above is NOT legal advice. By acting on anything I have said, you assume responsibility for any outcome and consequences. *
http://www.OntarioTicket.com OR http://www.OHTA.ca
Hi RadarIdentified, Thank you so much!!! A lot of information to process... I will definitely be going to court, and will apply for a disclosure to get the officer's notes before a trial. If there is even the remote possibility of getting this ticket cancelled, I'm definitely up for it (50/50 odds sound pretty good to me). I'm thinking though that I will try to speak to the Prosecutor before-hand if possible, and plea bargain it down to something without demerit points (Thanks for letting me know, I didnt know something like this was possible.) I'm still in the high-risk category so I think my insurance rates will skyrocket... How exactly would I apply for a disclosure if you dont mind me asking? And would I need to apply to speak to a Prosecutor or just find out which one is assigned to this case? Totally clueless about how this process works but will definitely take all the help I can get... Thanks so much! :)
Hi RadarIdentified,
Thank you so much!!! A lot of information to process...
I will definitely be going to court, and will apply for a disclosure to get the officer's notes before a trial. If there is even the remote possibility of getting this ticket cancelled, I'm definitely up for it (50/50 odds sound pretty good to me).
I'm thinking though that I will try to speak to the Prosecutor before-hand if possible, and plea bargain it down to something without demerit points (Thanks for letting me know, I didnt know something like this was possible.) I'm still in the high-risk category so I think my insurance rates will skyrocket...
How exactly would I apply for a disclosure if you dont mind me asking? And would I need to apply to speak to a Prosecutor or just find out which one is assigned to this case? Totally clueless about how this process works but will definitely take all the help I can get...
Some courthouses in Toronto offer "walk-in" first attendance, where you can simply show up and try to resolve your case by meeting with a Prosecutor. In that case, it really is as easy as just showing up (after you have a trial scheduled) at the times when they're offering it, and asking to speak to a Prosecutor. If they don't offer it, you can schedule a meeting with a Prosecutor for a plea-bargain. If nothing else, on the day of trial, you can show up early and see if the officer is there, and if so, see what they are willing to give you. After you get your trial date in the mail, you can fax a disclosure request, mail it via registered mail or courier, or drop it off at the courthouse yourself. Beware the on-line forms offered by the city of Toronto! They only say "I want disclosure," they don't give you options on what to ask for. Check out this webpage: http://www.ticketcombat.com/step4/disclosurehow.php A word of caution: On there is a sample disclosure form that you can use, but it is a sample only! It talks about things like statements made by the defendant, witness contact information, etc. You have to modify the requests to your case. The rest of the form is good, but I'd suggest asking for: - A full copy of the officer's notes, typed if not clear and legible, and - Any photographic and/or video evidence, if it exists and the Crown intends to use it at trial And that's it. It should be focused and to the point. Some people ask for all kinds of irrelevant and extraneous material, and that only makes it much harder to get a stay if the Crown fails to provide disclosure.
SunshineGirl wrote:
I'm thinking though that I will try to speak to the Prosecutor before-hand if possible, and plea bargain it down to something without demerit points (Thanks for letting me know, I didnt know something like this was possible.) I'm still in the high-risk category so I think my insurance rates will skyrocket...
Some courthouses in Toronto offer "walk-in" first attendance, where you can simply show up and try to resolve your case by meeting with a Prosecutor. In that case, it really is as easy as just showing up (after you have a trial scheduled) at the times when they're offering it, and asking to speak to a Prosecutor. If they don't offer it, you can schedule a meeting with a Prosecutor for a plea-bargain. If nothing else, on the day of trial, you can show up early and see if the officer is there, and if so, see what they are willing to give you.
SunshineGirl wrote:
How exactly would I apply for a disclosure if you dont mind me asking?
After you get your trial date in the mail, you can fax a disclosure request, mail it via registered mail or courier, or drop it off at the courthouse yourself. Beware the on-line forms offered by the city of Toronto! They only say "I want disclosure," they don't give you options on what to ask for. Check out this webpage:
A word of caution: On there is a sample disclosure form that you can use, but it is a sample only! It talks about things like statements made by the defendant, witness contact information, etc. You have to modify the requests to your case. The rest of the form is good, but I'd suggest asking for:
- A full copy of the officer's notes, typed if not clear and legible, and
- Any photographic and/or video evidence, if it exists and the Crown intends to use it at trial
And that's it. It should be focused and to the point. Some people ask for all kinds of irrelevant and extraneous material, and that only makes it much harder to get a stay if the Crown fails to provide disclosure.
* The above is NOT legal advice. By acting on anything I have said, you assume responsibility for any outcome and consequences. *
http://www.OntarioTicket.com OR http://www.OHTA.ca
I followed the procedures mentioned in the previous threads regarding the disclosure and received it today. My court date is November 5 2009 in Whitby. After going through the notes I realized 2 things:
1- the notes are horribly illegible and difficult to read
2- I have notes from two different officers.
Now I am not sure if this means that both the officers will be at court for the hearing or…
I hope I can paint the picture with the accuracy that the truth deserves. I have no intention of just beating a ticket.. but more like beating a really unfair ticket. You decide!
I had entered Canada after a short trip downsouth through Detroit on my way to Toronto. Not being equipped with a GPS unit I had to rely on the printable poorman's version from Mapquest. I followed Huron Church Rd.,…
Need an expert advice here. 10 days ago I got a speeding ticket. Ticket has a fatal error on its face-offense not known to law. It says speeding 75km/hr in posted 60km/hr zone. What is the best way to proceed?
1. Should I completely ignore this ticket and let the JP to quash it?
2. Should I go with option 3 - request a trial and force the fatal error by not showing up at court?
My name is Brian. I am in my late 20s and live in Toronto. I do not own a car but half a dozen times a year I rent one with my Visa. (To get out of the city and go to a beach or ski for example.)
I have never drunk and drive but I face a problem and Im wondering if anyone can tell me what to do. Several months ago I was at a weekend party and had quit a bit to consume. When I stopped…
I was travelling east bound on ellesmere road and approached markham road attempting to make a right turn. All signal lights were red and cars traveling down markham road south were given the green arrow. I slowed down and attempted to make the right turn. I got ticketed by a cop who was parked in a gas station facing the intersection in a (no parking zone). I…
Crested a hill, officer coming at me, pulled a u turn and pulled me over.
I will go back and look again but I thought I was in an 80 not a 70 and I am positive I wasn't doing more than 120. My speedo read 110-115. I have aftermarket tires and rims so I assume this would be the difference.
It was around 7pm, already dark, nobody on the road but myself,…
I am looking for the case law that is commonly used when the prosecution says they only need to disclose the testing pages of a radar manual or laser manual.
I am only interested in the binding decisions (appeals court or higher?), and not in the non-binding Justice of the Peace decisions.
I was pulled over two nights ago and charged with failing to stop a stop sign. On the ticket, it says 'disobey stop sign - foil to stop' and does not say 'fail' -- something I think may be a fatal flaw? I have been driving for 12 years with no tickets, yet I live in Brampton where insurance prices are high so I do not want to be convicted as my insurance rates will spike significantly and…
A friend of mine (who is from China and with no knowledge of English at all) asked me to interpret for him on court.
He got pulled over by a stealth patrol car last october, got 3 tickets (fail to show insurance card, using cell phones and fail to stop on right for emergency vehicle) , court date is next week. He told me his insurance expired for less than a month and other charges are false…
I understand the severity of my offences, and I can't stress how much I regret it. I know I endangered the lives of myself and more importantly others. I usually do not speed and I know running late for work is an unacceptable excuse. I will be a man and accept the consequences of my actions although I would appreciate any advice for my situation.
Guys back in january i got a speeding ticket on dvp, but i am 90% sure he did not caught me on radar, i asked for disclosure request and i just received today, I have asked for: a full copy of the police officers notes, a copy of both sides of the officers copy of the ticket, witness will say statements, speed gun manual, calibration record, repair history and officer's training certificate but…
I need some help here. So today I was on my way to get my tires changed from my winter tires to my regular summer staggered set of tires. I was driving in mississauga on my way to my destination, I got pulled over by an officer where I was given a ticket for having improper mudguards. For some context, I drive a stock 2013 C63 AMG with winter tires at the time. I was never…
I'd like to start this off by saying for the last two weeks I have been browsing the forums. I'm trying to prepare myself for an early resolution meeting with a prosecutor (in Brampton, if that matters). I have a clean record and as a teacher, I always do my best to follow rules (trying to practice what I preach!)
On December 4, 2014 I was preparing to turn right at a very busy intersection.…
I have question, today I was going to work in my normal route there is a triangle intersection with my side being the only one with a stop sign.
There's a car in front me who stopped at the stop sign, and the third-side there's a incoming car with their hazard-light flashing but they don't have stop sign, yet coming in at a slow speed.
Right after the car in front me went through the stop sign,…
On my way to work this morning I received a ticket for disobey sign. I was on Hwy 10 Mississauga in the right lane. The right lane leads to the 401 and there is a sign saying Right Lane Exits. I Tried to merge left before the on ramp as did 3 other people. We all got a ticket for doing that. Is there anything I can do? I did not realize I was breaking any law it was a dotted line where I tried to…
This is my first post, before I jump right in I would like to thank the forum, members, posters and moderators for all the information posted. I feel like I have been able to learn a lot from others experiences, so thank you all.
This will be a lengthy post. But if you are dealing with a Disobey Sign HTA 182(2) - No Straight Through Intersection you may find this extremely…
Let me start this with saying that this isn't in regards to a ticket, more a discussion surrounding front license plates and learning about the rules behind them. (Most of the quote stuff is using colloquial terms, mostly because I couldn't really find a better way to describe it; it's not meant to be offensive.)
I know Ontario law/HTA mandates having a front license plate unlike some States in…
Hi Guys! I've just had my trial day yesterday. I was not at fault but was convicted anyways.
It is such a travesty! There is no justice at the traffic court. It is just a no mercy machine to part someone with his money, no common sense applies and no reasonable argument being considered. Such a shame! The justice, the policeman and the prosecutor ganged up against me. The justice kept interrupting…
Well first of all ... glad to have found the forum - hoping to find answers to 'alot' of questions
I was unfortunate in July 2010 in that I ended up rolling my 2009 Ranger three times, through a fence and landing on the roof on a rained-out road that was/is in need of proper repair in Eastern Ontario.
I was assisted out of the vehicle by the driver who was behind me.
I was traveling down the 401, noticed a speed trap, and started flashing my lights -- in order to warn oncoming drivers.
Within a 30 seconds, a car slowed, crossed the grass, and approached me from behind. Lights appeared, and I then realised that this was an officer in an undercover car.
The officer pulled me over, and while he was polite, clearly his motivation was to…
Does anyone know the specific law, statute, Charter right to refer to when a prosecutor or justice attempts to change the charge on a ticket after a trial has begun? I assume I'd object immediately (without interrupting anyone, of course) but what would be the specific legal basis of my objection?
I was right behind a school bus that looked like it was pulling over to the side in order to turn down a side street, I saw no lights so decided to go around (wide street). Was still moving as I was passing, then as I did pass I heard horn and looked back and in fact it was pulling over to p/u school kids (was a block away from my son's school, so just assumed it wouldn't be picking up kids...it…
