Plea for lesser charge from Driving While Under Suspension

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mr888
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by: mr888 on
Mon Sep 07, 2009 11:01 pm

cruzmisl wrote:Can't have a licence from Quebec and be suspended in Ontario without getting charged. Its illegal. If that were the case everyone would just go to another province and get a new licence.

As far as not knowing about your suspension the courts find, after 7 days of the start date, you are considered served. This means you essentially have no defence to it.

I'd take the no d/l deal and run.
I have no deal, this just happened a few days ago, the court date is in a month or so, you are confusing the OP and me, what happened is, I was visiting Toronto back around the last holiday season and got some tickets, I guess i sort of forgot about them, and they got convicted ( improper headlights) or something small like that, but since I had an Ontario licence some years ago, they automaticly put the info on my Ontario licence and must of sent notices to my old address that I didn't live at for years.. so there was no way of me knowing I was suspended, you see?


cruzmisl
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by: cruzmisl on
Tue Sep 08, 2009 12:26 am

I'm not confusing you and the OP. The OP should take the deal and you need to see if you can get the same. You can come up with any excuse but it doesn't matter. You need to pay your outstanding fines before getting a licence from another province.


mr888
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by: mr888 on
Tue Sep 08, 2009 12:45 pm

cruzmisl wrote:I'm not confusing you and the OP. The OP should take the deal and you need to see if you can get the same. You can come up with any excuse but it doesn't matter. You need to pay your outstanding fines before getting a licence from another province.
What do you mean before? i got those previous tickets driving with my Quebec licence, they just went on the ontario licence record as well.


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by: Radar Identified on
Tue Sep 08, 2009 2:36 pm

Just to clarify something, at no point did you have two drivers' licences from different provinces, right? As in, when you moved from Ontario to Quebec, you surrendered your Ontario licence to Quebec in exchange for the Quebec licence, correct?


cruzmisl
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by: cruzmisl on
Tue Sep 08, 2009 3:37 pm

I suspect the officers somehow found out you had an Ontario licence; possibly through a records check. You surrendered a Quebec licence but still had a valid Ontario licence on the system. You were probably driving an Ontario plated car at the time. If that's the case they ran you in Ontario to see if you were suspended and learned of the Ontario d/l and wrote the tickets accordingly.

There is no way the fines ended up on your Ontario d/l when they were written with the Quebec info, if that's what your suggesting


mr888
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by: mr888 on
Tue Sep 08, 2009 10:41 pm

At no point did I have 2 licences, I moved to Quebec in 2005 and surrendered my ONT licence, when I got pulled over I had a Quebec licence and a Quebec plated car, the only way they found out about me previously living in Ontario is they run my name and DOB for warrants and find that I previously had a ONT licence which has long expired, but still issue tickets on that licence, so it gets suspended if any fines are unpaid...


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by: cruzmisl on
Tue Sep 08, 2009 11:20 pm

Hmmm, I can't see them writing you a ticket using an expired licence. In any case you'll need to take it to court and explain what happened to the Crown. You may need a trip to the MTO for documention on when your d/l was expired.


mr888
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by: mr888 on
Tue Sep 08, 2009 11:33 pm

Yeah, i'm going to the court tomorrow to pay the fine, I know for a fact the ONT licence expired on August 2007, so I find it awkward they still write the ticket with my ontario DL# on the ticket, basicly the cop was hinting at something like oh you cannot run away from your fines, we know you are from ontario but have a quebec licence lol jackass, but in reality he does not even know that DL is long expired.


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by: OPS Copper on
Thu Sep 10, 2009 10:38 pm

You are issued one DL # in Ontario for ever. the number never goes away......The tickets were issued to your quebec lisc. when you did not pay they applied the suspension to your old Ontario DL...If you had never had an ontario DL they would have generated an Ontario DL#..

This is done because the province has no authority to suspend another provinces DL

C


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by: Proper1 on
Fri Sep 11, 2009 7:15 am

OPS Copper wrote:You are issued one DL # in Ontario for ever. the number never goes away......The tickets were issued to your quebec lisc. when you did not pay they applied the suspension to your old Ontario DL...If you had never had an ontario DL they would have generated an Ontario DL#..

This is done because the province has no authority to suspend another provinces DL
Sounds a bit dodgy, but makes sense: I can be suspended from driving in Ontario for something I do or fail to do in Ontario. As long as I don't try driving in Ontario again everybody's happy.

Does make ya wonder about our machine-generated "offenses," though. If the red-light camera system decides that a car with plates I used to own has offended, and sends the info to a place where I used to live, then causes eventual suspension of an Ontario licence that I used to have, I could have a big surprise waiting for me some day when I come back to visit Mummy and Daddy in Brantford.


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by: OPS Copper on
Fri Sep 11, 2009 8:21 am

Why is it dodgy...if the person did not pay the Ontario fine then Yeah they are suspended from driving here....

I am not sure if machine tickets work the same....I seems to vaguely remember that they do not result in suspension but go to collection agencies for payment....but not 100% sure

GS


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by: mr888 on
Sat Sep 12, 2009 2:10 am

I actually figured out the situation a little, I have a bunch of old fines on my ontario record from what it looks like, but only 1 is suspending me and the reason is, the cop wrote my ontario DL# on that ticket, and when it got convicted it automaticly put a suspension on it, but the other fines I have went straight to collection because my proper quebec DL# was used.

Pretty lame surprise though, aren't they supposed to give me just a notice of suspension the first time you get caught? not a ticket right away..


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by: Proper1 on
Sat Sep 12, 2009 7:21 am

OPS Copper wrote:Why is it dodgy
I should have expressed myself more clearly. I meant only that it sounds dodgy to a layman -- until he thinks about it (which is often a good idea).

Machine-generated tickets are another matter, but when a (reasonably) live cop hands me a ticket, I know that I have been charged. I know that if I choose not to contest, I will be convicted and fined. I know that if I don't pay the fine, Ontario will eventually, probably, ban me from driving here. So if I drive in Ontario anyway I know I'm rolling the dice. Simple. How the records trail is generated is not my problem.


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by: hwybear on
Sat Sep 12, 2009 9:16 am

mr888 wrote:I actually figured out the situation a little, I have a bunch of old fines on my ontario record from what it looks like, but only 1 is suspending me and the reason is, the cop wrote my ontario DL# on that ticket, and when it got convicted it automaticly put a suspension on it, but the other fines I have went straight to collection because my proper quebec DL# was used.

Pretty lame surprise though, aren't they supposed to give me just a notice of suspension the first time you get caught? not a ticket right away..
What type of ticket did you get? what does it look like? colour?

the ticket is filed by police, reviewed by JP, conviction registered, and court does not get their payment. The Court then does 2 things:
1) Court notifies MTO of the lack of payment and the MTO observes that the driver has a QC DL. They also check and see that the driver used to have an ONT DL. The MTO does not need to "generate" a new ONT DL as the driver previously had a licence in Ontario. MTO then suspends the ONT DL (as they can not suspend a licence from anywhere else)
2) Court contacts a collection agency as the person resides outside of Ontario and that person may never come back to Ontario.
Above is merely a suggestion/thought and in no way constitutes legal advice or views of my employer. www.OHTA.ca


mr888
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by: mr888 on
Sat Sep 12, 2009 2:45 pm

hwybear wrote:
mr888 wrote:I actually figured out the situation a little, I have a bunch of old fines on my ontario record from what it looks like, but only 1 is suspending me and the reason is, the cop wrote my ontario DL# on that ticket, and when it got convicted it automaticly put a suspension on it, but the other fines I have went straight to collection because my proper quebec DL# was used.

Pretty lame surprise though, aren't they supposed to give me just a notice of suspension the first time you get caught? not a ticket right away..
What type of ticket did you get? what does it look like? colour?

the ticket is filed by police, reviewed by JP, conviction registered, and court does not get their payment. The Court then does 2 things:
1) Court notifies MTO of the lack of payment and the MTO observes that the driver has a QC DL. They also check and see that the driver used to have an ONT DL. The MTO does not need to "generate" a new ONT DL as the driver previously had a licence in Ontario. MTO then suspends the ONT DL (as they can not suspend a licence from anywhere else)
2) Court contacts a collection agency as the person resides outside of Ontario and that person may never come back to Ontario.
Got a yellow summons ticket for "driving under suspension", and a pink notice of suspension, so if they are notifying me, why give a ticket as well?

I had these type of situations before, where I was not aware I was suspended and got served a pink notice of suspension which they made me sign, but never a ticket to go with it.


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