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Disobeying Sign HTA 182(2) - Richmond Hill
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 02, 2014 6:25 pm 
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Joined: Sat Mar 01, 2014 4:06 pm
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Thursday I was on my way to work (404 and 16th in Richmond Hill), and I left my place here in Woodbridge and was about to take my normal route across hwy 7 to Leslie. Traffic was jammed from Jane for all the construction going on, so I decided to take 400 to Major Mac, and go East across Major Mac and come South on Leslie to avoid the traffic.

So, everything was good until a little after Major Mac and Bayview. Traffic was pretty bad along Major Mac. Eventually I got 2 cars away from the intersection of Major Mac and Boake Trail (1 Street from Leslie). It's a green light, and there's enough traffic that no one is moving yet. At this point it's after 9 and I'm a little late for work. Cars to my right are taking the right hand turn down Boake Trail to avoid the traffic. About 3 cars make their turn, before I said screw it and decided to make the same right. Only to then realize a cop is waiting down the street and had the 3 cars, plus myself pull over.

I pull over, and had no idea what was wrong. The officer went to the first 3 cars, then made his way over to mine. He then told me that the reason he pulled me over was to eliminate the amount of traffic and that I was not supposed to make that right hand turn as there was a time for no right turns posted (7am-9am). He then asked for my insurance, and license, then went to his car. At this point I'm looking at the clock in my car and it's showing after 9, which I knew previously because I was late for work.

He then came back to my car gave me my license, insurance, and a ticket for Disobeying the Sign. The time on the ticket said 8:58am. By this point it was like 9:15.... I wasn't going to argue with him about it as I knew it wouldn't get me anywhere... He just simply said that he issued me a ticket for it, and that there were 2 signs posted for it.

Later I google mapped the intersection and there actually were 2 signs posted, but I never noticed as I didn't have any intention of turning anyways. 1 was posted exactly where the right lane opens up to make the turn, and another at the actual lights in the intersection (Which is totally my fault for missing), however the time I had was after 9...

I understand that I have no argument for not seeing the signs, but do I have anything with regards to my time showing after 9, and having other cars making the turn that only led me to believe it was accurate? Especially since the ticket says 8:58 am, Is there anyway that the time would have to be confirmed to be accurate whether from the officers stand point, or mine?

Any information you can provide will be of help.

Thank you.


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Re: Disobeying Sign HTA 182(2) - Richmond Hill
PostPosted: Sun Mar 02, 2014 7:06 pm 
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Joined: Sun Dec 01, 2013 8:42 pm
Posts: 31
the time on the ticket is not going to matter especially since its only a few minutes off.


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Re: Disobeying Sign HTA 182(2) - Richmond Hill
PostPosted: Mon Mar 03, 2014 12:30 am 
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Joined: Wed Mar 30, 2011 1:08 pm
Posts: 536
Location: Ontario
Request trial, get disclosure. If the turn is legal is after 9am and your ticket says 8:58 you would be disputing only the time that it is was after 9am that you turned and since it was after 9 it was perfectly legal.

I think you could beat this at trial if you present strong unwavering testimony that you saw the sign, checked your clock to make sure it was past 9am, then turned legally as the other cars were doing. You would have to testify that you clock is accurate and you check it for accuracy daily against your cellphone. You don't need to tell them about you whole drive that morning and I would not say I didn't see the sign as it would make you less credible about checking the time. Being sure it was past 9 when you made that turn is key.

I would also be prepared to argue for a grace period of a few minutes to account for a margin of error. See if you can find some case law on canlii

Good luck.


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Re: Disobeying Sign HTA 182(2) - Richmond Hill
PostPosted: Tue Mar 04, 2014 3:23 pm 
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Joined: Sat Mar 01, 2014 4:06 pm
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ynotp wrote:
Request trial, get disclosure. If the turn is legal is after 9am and your ticket says 8:58 you would be disputing only the time that it is was after 9am that you turned and since it was after 9 it was perfectly legal.

I think you could beat this at trial if you present strong unwavering testimony that you saw the sign, checked your clock to make sure it was past 9am, then turned legally as the other cars were doing. You would have to testify that you clock is accurate and you check it for accuracy daily against your cellphone. You don't need to tell them about you whole drive that morning and I would not say I didn't see the sign as it would make you less credible about checking the time. Being sure it was past 9 when you made that turn is key.

I would also be prepared to argue for a grace period of a few minutes to account for a margin of error. See if you can find some case law on canlii

Good luck.


Thank you for your help and information. I will see what I can find on canlii regarding any margin of error. So far I haven't been able to find anything, but I'll keep looking.


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