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Re: Picked UP disclosure for trial..Improper ?
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 07, 2011 2:28 pm 
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Location: In YOUR rearview mirror!
Court Reporter has officer availability matched with court dates right in front of them (on the computer) and that is what they choose for adjournment dates. I know, been there dozens of times (when defendant wants an adjournment at last minute), just flip open my daytimer and add the person to the new date, always just an add on to the list.
Only time they care which JP is a continuation of the same trial in progress, which the same JP will continue the trial.

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Re: Picked UP disclosure for trial..Improper ?
PostPosted: Fri Jan 07, 2011 4:09 pm 
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fredfred wrote:
hwybear wrote:
fredfred wrote:
If you ask for a stay from the JP when you are called up to plead and you get an adjournment, your new court date will most likely be one on that JP's next scheduled court dates and not the date that the officer has his/her cases scheduled for (maybe adds another 2 to 4 months). That would reduce the chance of the officer showing up as they would most likely only have one case on that date. .


The courts don't care which JP is "sitting" for court. They schedule as per officer availability/schedule (courts also have each officer's booked vacation dates to avoid)


That may be true if a motion is filed in advance, but when one is asked for in court and the JP decides to give an adjournment (after telling you that you should have given proper notice) he asks the court reporter what his next trial date is, and it is set for that one or the next one if the reporter says, "you have xx cases on that day and there is no room". The cop is sitting there and no one asks him/her whether it is a good date for them or whether this is their "special" day where all their cases are heard.



Not here they don't. Only thing they do is book on a mutual agreed date with the accused. Jp's schedule has no bearing and is not mentioned at all.

Prosecutor just stand and says this is the next date and JP grants it..

OPS


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Re: Picked UP disclosure for trial..Improper ?
PostPosted: Fri Jan 07, 2011 5:57 pm 
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fredfred wrote:
That may be true if a motion is filed in advance, but when one is asked for in court and the JP decides to give an adjournment (after telling you that you should have given proper notice) he asks the court reporter what his next trial date is, and it is set for that one or the next one if the reporter says, "you have xx cases on that day and there is no room". The cop is sitting there and no one asks him/her whether it is a good date for them or whether this is their "special" day where all their cases are heard.


That depends on whether it's already scheduled for trial and if it's being put over, preemptive on one side or the other, to proceed regardless of what happens at the next trial date. That rarely happens. Usually you will not have a date set until you get disclosure, so your next date will be for the matter to be spoken to (i.e. elect trial or plea) and they won't bring the officer back for that date. On the date it's spoke to, they will usually pick a date that the officer there for a bunch of matters. That's the way it usually happens.

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Re: Picked UP disclosure for trial..Improper ?
PostPosted: Fri Jan 07, 2011 6:01 pm 
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diehard wrote:
Can OP ask JP to quash the case?

Or is a motion also needed for that?


Just asking for it to be quashed is a motion for dismissal. What I was referring to is that they usually want a written submission (factum) prepared on the issue before they grant a motion for dismissal on insufficient disclosure. That's where you get to set out your argument and support it with case law and the crown gets to present theirs. You could just ask in court, but I think they'd want to hear some more arguments if your reason is insufficient disclosure.

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Re: Picked UP disclosure for trial..Improper ?
PostPosted: Sat Jan 08, 2011 2:34 am 
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Ok so my trial is this wednesday at approx 1 30. A question i had was if the cop doesn't show up and i ask for it to be dismissed but the jp instead adjourns it.Is that possible. When i am about to enter a plea isnt the cop suppose to be present ?


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Re: Picked UP disclosure for trial..Improper ?
PostPosted: Sat Jan 08, 2011 11:51 am 
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The officer doesn't have to be present for your plea. If he's not there, the crown can and probably will ask for it to be adjourned.

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Re: Picked UP disclosure for trial..Improper ?
PostPosted: Sat Jan 08, 2011 5:23 pm 
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Simon Borys wrote:
If he's not there, the crown can and probably will ask for it to be adjourned.


That is, unless it's in much of the GTA, or, sometimes, Ottawa, in which case they'll usually withdraw (unless it's serious). Otherwise, yes...

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Re: Picked UP disclosure for trial..Improper ?
PostPosted: Mon Jan 10, 2011 7:22 pm 
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ok so just to confirm one thing before my trial... When i get called up i will say "Your honor, i would like this case to be dismissed on the grounds of improper disclosure" right? But the thing is if i did do and i instead get an adjourment but the officer is not even there which will benefit the prosecution. Could i ask for the case to be dismissed after i enter the not guilty plea?


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Re: Picked UP disclosure for trial..Improper ?
PostPosted: Tue Jan 11, 2011 11:41 am 
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Simon Borys wrote:
fredfred wrote:
That may be true if a motion is filed in advance, but when one is asked for in court and the JP decides to give an adjournment (after telling you that you should have given proper notice) he asks the court reporter what his next trial date is, and it is set for that one or the next one if the reporter says, "you have xx cases on that day and there is no room". The cop is sitting there and no one asks him/her whether it is a good date for them or whether this is their "special" day where all their cases are heard.


That depends on whether it's already scheduled for trial and if it's being put over, preemptive on one side or the other, to proceed regardless of what happens at the next trial date. That rarely happens. Usually you will not have a date set until you get disclosure, so your next date will be for the matter to be spoken to (i.e. elect trial or plea) and they won't bring the officer back for that date. On the date it's spoke to, they will usually pick a date that the officer there for a bunch of matters. That's the way it usually happens.


I was given a choice by the JP to come back in a couple of weeks and set a date or set a new trial date then and there. I chose the latter. My point was that the original trial date seems to be set so that the officer has multiple cases on that day meaning they are pretty well guaranteed to show up. The adjournment date, on the other hand, is not picked so as to be convenient for the officer and will probably be his/her only case on that day. That makes the chance of them attending lower. They may like to attend court, but their superior may decide it's not a cost effective way to use resources.


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Re: Picked UP disclosure for trial..Improper ?
PostPosted: Tue Jan 11, 2011 1:29 pm 
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Guess it depends on how serious the charge is...

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Re: Picked UP disclosure for trial..Improper ?
PostPosted: Tue Jan 11, 2011 5:18 pm 
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how serious of a charge is speeding 33 over?


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Re: Picked UP disclosure for trial..Improper ?
PostPosted: Tue Jan 11, 2011 10:14 pm 
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bilal388 wrote:
how serious of a charge is speeding 33 over?


Mine was 35 over... adjournment got the total delay to 13 weeks and I filed a 11b which got it stayed...


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Re: Picked UP disclosure for trial..Improper ?
PostPosted: Wed Jan 12, 2011 1:35 am 
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hmm hope to get the same thing if not the outright stay cause that will make the trial date juts about 12 months from the offence date......ill keep you guys posted of what happens

Hey just wondering my brother got a ticket for careless driving,driving with no license and he filed it at the markham court house and he still hasnt heard from them about a court date..He filed it before i did so that makes it about 8 months without even getting a date...should he call them and ask them or should he just let it stay like that?


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Re: Picked UP disclosure for trial..Improper ?
PostPosted: Wed Jan 12, 2011 12:12 pm 
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fredfred wrote:
bilal388 wrote:
how serious of a charge is speeding 33 over?


Mine was 35 over... adjournment got the total delay to 13 weeks and I filed a 11b which got it stayed...



Oops...meant 13 months not 13 weeks.....


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Re: Picked UP disclosure for trial..Improper ?
PostPosted: Wed Jan 12, 2011 6:43 pm 
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ok so i went to ..ill recap for u guys what happened

I reach there about at 110 wait for the line to clear up and check in with the prosecutor where she pleads me to take a deal. I told her straight up that i will not take any deal of any kind and just went and sat inside the court.Also the prosecutor(lady) was a complete bi***. Shes like all we had to do is prove u were going 51 and you lose i am like its ok ill go to trial. Then when i am sitting inside again she comes to me and pulls me outside.Then shes says the same bs all over again by this time the officer was present. I told her straight up that im going to ask for a dismissal because you did not provide me with proper disclosure. Shes like what are you talking about. Itold i cant read these notes because they are written like a chicken writes(not like that but she got the point). At this point she was being a total bi*** about it. She tells me that I AM NOT ENTITLED TO ANYTHING MORE THAN WHAT I GOT.shes like U WILL NOT BE GIVEN TYPED NOTES.then shes like you can go with the officer in the corner and he will read you what happened. At this time im like wtf is this. So i told the officer that you theres no point of you telling me this so i didnt listen to it and sat inside. Now for some reason most of the people in the court there officer wasnt even present and they got away with it. My officer by the looks of it wanted to extra money thats why he was there. Nevertheless i got called up gave my name etc. Then i told the jp that im asking for a dismissal he denied that and talked to the officer. Officer is like hes asking for a typed copy of the notes,make model ,procedure etc. The officer is like i am ok with that but the prosecutor is not. So the Jp's like we will adjourn this to another date. Now the first date the other lady said was Jan 31 but luckily nothing was free until like March(i also told them i cant do feb first week because of midterms) so they fit me inside a 66 line day on March 28 even though the other lady was like there are already so many people there but ya. Then the officer is like i will type them up and give you a call and like we have your information. Then the case was finished. So my question is

How should i go about receiving that typed version of the notes?He said they will contact me but just to be sure should i ask them or something? And also March 28 will make it about 10 months and 2 weeks since i got the ticket how is that if i file for 11b?

Thanks


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