Hi all, I received a stunt driving ticket earlier in the year (171 km/h in a 100 km/h zone) and attended my summons earlier this week, where I received the disclosure. I set a meeting for an early resolution for this Friday (March 16th, 2018). Would any of you be able to help me review my disclosure and help me assess my options? I'd also very much appreciate any advice for the meeting with the prosecutor (what I should say, etc). Needless to say, I feel awful about my behaviour and have learned a very expensive lesson ($1500 impound/tow fees). I need advice on how to proceed and hopefully put this behind me. Some facts: - It was early morning (7:30 AM on 401 near Scarborough), I was on my way to work and late for a meeting - The road was mostly clear with light traffic, high visibility, sunny day and clear driving conditions - The officer was on the road side, clocked me driving at 171 km/h at a distance of 148.35m - I promptly pulled over when he came after me, was polite and cooperative during our interaction - In the disclosure, I can see the officer's notes which says that he had tested the LIDAR at 3m, 10m and 45m as per manufacturer's guidelines and found it to be in good working condition.
Hi all,
I received a stunt driving ticket earlier in the year (171 km/h in a 100 km/h zone) and attended my summons earlier this week, where I received the disclosure.
I set a meeting for an early resolution for this Friday (March 16th, 2018). Would any of you be able to help me review my disclosure and help me assess my options? I'd also very much appreciate any advice for the meeting with the prosecutor (what I should say, etc).
Needless to say, I feel awful about my behaviour and have learned a very expensive lesson ($1500 impound/tow fees). I need advice on how to proceed and hopefully put this behind me.
Some facts:
- It was early morning (7:30 AM on 401 near Scarborough), I was on my way to work and late for a meeting
- The road was mostly clear with light traffic, high visibility, sunny day and clear driving conditions
- The officer was on the road side, clocked me driving at 171 km/h at a distance of 148.35m
- I promptly pulled over when he came after me, was polite and cooperative during our interaction
- In the disclosure, I can see the officer's notes which says that he had tested the LIDAR at 3m, 10m and 45m as per manufacturer's guidelines and found it to be in good working condition.
This is one of those situations where you'd hope they might offer a reduction to 149km. If they end up doing so, it might be worth considering the offer. The difference between 49km over and 50+ is way too big to pass up on.
This is one of those situations where you'd hope they might offer a reduction to 149km.
If they end up doing so, it might be worth considering the offer. The difference between 49km over and 50+ is way too big to pass up on.
Yeah thanks for your response. I'm definitely hoping for a 49 or under! Does anyone have anything else to add? I'm looking for anything in specific that can help with the prosecutor. I've heard dressing well and looking like you give a *EDIT* helps. Any advice on what to say? Also, the facts I've included is essentially everything from the disclosure. How do I gauge whether or not that is a good set of evidence for the crown? I'll 100% take the 49 or under deal if given, but I still would like to know whether they have a strong case against me or not.
Yeah thanks for your response. I'm definitely hoping for a 49 or under! Does anyone have anything else to add? I'm looking for anything in specific that can help with the prosecutor.
I've heard dressing well and looking like you give a *EDIT* helps. Any advice on what to say?
Also, the facts I've included is essentially everything from the disclosure. How do I gauge whether or not that is a good set of evidence for the crown? I'll 100% take the 49 or under deal if given, but I still would like to know whether they have a strong case against me or not.
The officer will testify that you were traveling at 171km/h and that he tested the device based on the manufacturer's guidelines. That is enough to convict you of stunt driving, unless you're able to disprove his evidence. At early resolution, if the prosecutor doesn't offer you a deal, you can simply ask for 49km/h and say that you will plead guilty to that charge. The prosecutor may or may not accept your request. If the prosecutor does not accept the request, it would be a good idea to get legal representation for trial (lawyer or paralegal). The consequences for stunt driving are significant: * fine between $2,000 and $10,000 OR * imprisonment of up to 6 months OR * both AND * license suspension of up to 2 years
The officer will testify that you were traveling at 171km/h and that he tested the device based on the manufacturer's guidelines. That is enough to convict you of stunt driving, unless you're able to disprove his evidence.
At early resolution, if the prosecutor doesn't offer you a deal, you can simply ask for 49km/h and say that you will plead guilty to that charge. The prosecutor may or may not accept your request. If the prosecutor does not accept the request, it would be a good idea to get legal representation for trial (lawyer or paralegal). The consequences for stunt driving are significant:
Thanks for your response. Unfortunately, at the early resolution meeting, the prosecutor did not offer me a deal to reduce to 49 under. He simply said to plead guilty and request a lowered fine. He said that if I go to trial, they will go for maximum fine and license suspension. Is he just trying to scare me into pleading guilty? Can someone advise if it's genuinely a good idea to just plead guilty now so I get a relatively low fine and no license suspension or should I pursue a trial? Please advice, I'm clearly out of my depth here.
Thanks for your response.
Unfortunately, at the early resolution meeting, the prosecutor did not offer me a deal to reduce to 49 under. He simply said to plead guilty and request a lowered fine. He said that if I go to trial, they will go for maximum fine and license suspension.
Is he just trying to scare me into pleading guilty? Can someone advise if it's genuinely a good idea to just plead guilty now so I get a relatively low fine and no license suspension or should I pursue a trial?
Did you say you'd be willing to plead guilty to 49 over? It's still worth asking for the trial. You still have the right to make a full answer and defence and to receive full disclosure of the evidence, including any evidence that may work in your favour. Before the trial begins, you can still try to negotiate a deal. But it's probably a good idea to invest in a lawyer or paralegal, just in case the prosecutor is not in a negotiating mood that day.
Did you say you'd be willing to plead guilty to 49 over?
It's still worth asking for the trial. You still have the right to make a full answer and defence and to receive full disclosure of the evidence, including any evidence that may work in your favour. Before the trial begins, you can still try to negotiate a deal. But it's probably a good idea to invest in a lawyer or paralegal, just in case the prosecutor is not in a negotiating mood that day.
Hey Zatota, thanks for the reply. Correct, I'd be willing to plead guilty to a 49 under charge. Unfortunately, I wasn't offered such a deal. I'm meeting with a paralegal tomorrow to review my disclosure. I'm hoping to get a good sense of whether or not I want to go to trial. I'm not opposed to going to trial, I'm just concerned whether going for a trial will make matters worse for me. Do you know if that's something that happens? Is it possible that simply pleading guilty will give me a less severe final result than going to court? The way the prosecutor from the early resolution meeting made it sound, I got the impression that going to trial will push them to go for more severe punishment and I'd like to avoid that... I have another question, but I won't bombard you with them all at once. I'll ask in my next reply to you. Looking forward to your reply.
Hey Zatota, thanks for the reply.
Correct, I'd be willing to plead guilty to a 49 under charge. Unfortunately, I wasn't offered such a deal.
I'm meeting with a paralegal tomorrow to review my disclosure. I'm hoping to get a good sense of whether or not I want to go to trial. I'm not opposed to going to trial, I'm just concerned whether going for a trial will make matters worse for me.
Do you know if that's something that happens? Is it possible that simply pleading guilty will give me a less severe final result than going to court? The way the prosecutor from the early resolution meeting made it sound, I got the impression that going to trial will push them to go for more severe punishment and I'd like to avoid that...
I have another question, but I won't bombard you with them all at once. I'll ask in my next reply to you. Looking forward to your reply.
Courts (generally) look more favourably upon people who submit a guilty plea. This saves time and resources for a full trial. There are countless examples in case law (both for criminal and provincial offences) where a lesser penalty is given for a guilty plea. As I mentioned in my previous post, there is a fine of $2,000 to $10,000 for stunt driving. The justice of the peace (JP) is required by law to give you a fine (or imprisonment - this is extremely unlikely though unless there is injury/death). The lowest fine you can hope for is $2,000 (unless you can show exceptional financial circumstances to warrant a lower fine). $2,000 would be given in instances, for example, where there is a guilty plea. It would be a lot less likely to get the minimum fine after going through a full trial and being found guilty after the fact. A licence suspension of up to 2 years may result upon conviction. The JP has discretion whether or not to suspend your licence at all. It is more likely to face no suspension or a shorter suspension if you plead guilty. Again, it is a lot less likely to get no suspension at all or a shorter suspension on the lower end of the spectrum (i.e., 30 days) after going through a full trial and being found guilty after the fact. The evidence against you provided in disclosure is enough to convict you of stunt driving (speed, and device tested). Unless you're able to show otherwise (which is hard to do for speeding-related offences), pleading guilty may be the best option. You should still retain a lawyer or paralegal if you plan on pleading guilty. They will help you make submissions on penalty (fine and licence suspension) to get you the best possible result.
Courts (generally) look more favourably upon people who submit a guilty plea. This saves time and resources for a full trial. There are countless examples in case law (both for criminal and provincial offences) where a lesser penalty is given for a guilty plea.
As I mentioned in my previous post, there is a fine of $2,000 to $10,000 for stunt driving. The justice of the peace (JP) is required by law to give you a fine (or imprisonment - this is extremely unlikely though unless there is injury/death). The lowest fine you can hope for is $2,000 (unless you can show exceptional financial circumstances to warrant a lower fine). $2,000 would be given in instances, for example, where there is a guilty plea. It would be a lot less likely to get the minimum fine after going through a full trial and being found guilty after the fact.
A licence suspension of up to 2 years may result upon conviction. The JP has discretion whether or not to suspend your licence at all. It is more likely to face no suspension or a shorter suspension if you plead guilty. Again, it is a lot less likely to get no suspension at all or a shorter suspension on the lower end of the spectrum (i.e., 30 days) after going through a full trial and being found guilty after the fact.
The evidence against you provided in disclosure is enough to convict you of stunt driving (speed, and device tested). Unless you're able to show otherwise (which is hard to do for speeding-related offences), pleading guilty may be the best option. You should still retain a lawyer or paralegal if you plan on pleading guilty. They will help you make submissions on penalty (fine and licence suspension) to get you the best possible result.
Hey Whenaxis, thanks for replying. In your previous message, you suggested that it'd be a good idea to set up for trial if denied a 49 under plea deal. To confirm and clarify, are you suggesting now that it's a good idea to plead guilty because there is a potential for worse punishments if I lose the trial? I'll be meeting a paralegal today to discuss what sort of defence I have, if any at all. Based on that I might be able to decide better what decision to make. Considering that it would cost me $1300 to retain, I'm not sure the benefit outweighs the cost? To me it seems unlikely that the lawyer would be able to offset his fees in reduction of penalty. The prosecutor informed me that they will not pursue a suspension if I plead guilty. So unless the lawyer is able to arrange a $700 fine ($1300 lower than minimum of $2000), I'd be losing money by retaining, no? What is your opinion on this thought process?
Hey Whenaxis, thanks for replying.
In your previous message, you suggested that it'd be a good idea to set up for trial if denied a 49 under plea deal.
To confirm and clarify, are you suggesting now that it's a good idea to plead guilty because there is a potential for worse punishments if I lose the trial? I'll be meeting a paralegal today to discuss what sort of defence I have, if any at all. Based on that I might be able to decide better what decision to make.
You should still retain a lawyer or paralegal if you plan on pleading guilty. They will help you make submissions on penalty (fine and licence suspension) to get you the best possible result.
Considering that it would cost me $1300 to retain, I'm not sure the benefit outweighs the cost? To me it seems unlikely that the lawyer would be able to offset his fees in reduction of penalty. The prosecutor informed me that they will not pursue a suspension if I plead guilty. So unless the lawyer is able to arrange a $700 fine ($1300 lower than minimum of $2000), I'd be losing money by retaining, no? What is your opinion on this thought process?
What I meant was whether you'd asked the prosecutor if he'd be willing to reduce the ticket to 49 over in exchange for a guilty plea. If the prosecutor doesn't offer it, there's nothing wrong with asking for it. The worst that can happen is the prosecutor says no. There's still one benefit to retaining a paralegal, despite the fees. If the paralegal is able to get the prosecutor to accept 49 over, you'll be looking at a minor offence for insurance purposes. Stunt driving is a major offence. The insurance implications are huge.
What I meant was whether you'd asked the prosecutor if he'd be willing to reduce the ticket to 49 over in exchange for a guilty plea. If the prosecutor doesn't offer it, there's nothing wrong with asking for it. The worst that can happen is the prosecutor says no.
There's still one benefit to retaining a paralegal, despite the fees. If the paralegal is able to get the prosecutor to accept 49 over, you'll be looking at a minor offence for insurance purposes. Stunt driving is a major offence. The insurance implications are huge.
There is no point in going for atrial unless you have a chance of winning. (f you know you are going to lose then ab solely plead guilty. You will be given a chance to address the judge before they pass sentence and this is where people get it wrong - they try to explain why they were speeding (for example) rather than just showing complete remorse. You've already pled guilty so excuses don't help, being able to convince the judge that you know you're a muppet and that you won't do it again, will
There is no point in going for atrial unless you have a chance of winning. (f you know you are going to lose then ab solely plead guilty. You will be given a chance to address the judge before they pass sentence and this is where people get it wrong - they try to explain why they were speeding (for example) rather than just showing complete remorse. You've already pled guilty so excuses don't help, being able to convince the judge that you know you're a muppet and that you won't do it again, will
Former Ontario Police Officer. Advice will become less relevant as the time goes by !
Hi, Could you please respond regarding to the hiring the paralegal, like did you hire any or not, and what was you final resolution? It will help me because I have been convicted of stunt driving recently and seeking help. regards
Hi,
Could you please respond regarding to the hiring the paralegal, like did you hire any or not, and what was you final resolution?
It will help me because I have been convicted of stunt driving recently and seeking help.
Hi, I am new to the forum. I have been trying to get information off of here and www.ticketcombat.com for my case.
I was given a ticket for going 122km/h in a posted 100km/h zone at Hwy 401 east at Thickson Rd in Whitby ON on April 10th, 2009.
I find this absolutely absurd, since I was in the left most lane of the 401 approximately(within 5km/h) following the speed of traffic in my lane. The guy in…
Hey this is my first ticket so as much information that people can provide will be appreciated. I was making the drive home going around 90kph(in a 80) behind what I knew was an undercover police car. The cop abruptly pulled to the side and pulled back in behind me to pull me over. Now I reduced my speed to below 80 when the cop pulled to the side but he claimed he had me clocked at 109kph and…
On Wednesday I attended court at 1530 Markham Road, courtroom E2, in order to fight my speeding ticket. My original plan was to plead not guilty, and to watch all the people who went before me, the process, the Prosecutor and the Justice Of The Peace so I could strategize and form the best plan for my defence at trial. I had done some research online and sort of knew I wanted to defend myself,…
About 5 months ago I was driving along a two-way road approaching an intersection. The road had a left/ straight turning lane and a right turning lane. There was an 18 wheel gravel truck occupying the left lane at a red light. I pulled behind the truck intending to drive straight. After not moving for about 1 second, I check my rear view mirror, signaled and changed lanes to the right…
I am currently working for an auto parts delivery company and they contracted me to work as a courier.
As I left my base to make my first delivery which was less than 300 meters away from the shop, I had my seat belt off because i was under the impression, according to Section 106 Exception #6 subsection (c) of the highway traffic act, that I would be exempted from the seat belt law. The rule…
Got a ticket yesterday for "Insecure Load" contrary to HTA Sec 111(2). $160. I was pulling a utility trailer in which I had loaded a steel and wood cabinet. Total length of cabinet is 57.5". 14.75" (1/4 of the cabinet) was sticking out over the side of the trailer at about a 45 degree angle, the rest (3/4) was inside the trailer. The trailer has sides 24" high. I didn't have a tie-down or bungee…
I've been researching for months for defence strategy and basic trial information regarding my speeding ticket. However, the information is so conflicting that I have no confidence whatsoever that I know what I'm doing.
I didn't get this info from a friend of a friend, it came from this website, court officials, case laws, and a consultation with a traffic ticket fighting company.
So I was driving east bound pulling an empty tandem trailer on a gravel highway. Eventually I caught up to a truck pulling a fifth wheel. The speed limit was 70km/h and I don't quite remember but I'm almost 100% that the guy in front of me was driving at 60km/h. After being behind him for a few kilometers and getting two cracks in my windshield from rocks off his tires, I decided to pass him. I…
I have been driving for over 10 years without any tickets and accidents what so ever. Unfortunately my luck ran out this past Friday; when the officer pulled me over doing 80 in a 50 zone in Mississauga, Ontario. Officer was very friendly and polite not to mention nice enough to reduce the charge to 15KM.
On the speeding ticket it now says doing 65km in a 50 zone. Never having a speeding…
hi everyone im just wondering if its right for a cop to have my car impounded and give me a traffic ticket for improper plates when my car didnt leave my property, yes i knew the plates werent to my car but on private property it dont matter aslong as it dosent go onto public property. am i right with this that i shouldnt have gotten the ticket or my car impounded?????????????
Have been busy and haven't had much time to follow up on this...
Went to court having not received disclosure (and was not organized enough to apply for a stay), so the trial was adjourned. They photocopied the officer's ticket and notes and provided a log sheet from the plane. I've sent another request for the rest of the disclosure items.
So here's my question -- can an officer amend the ticket…
Hi guys, I got pulled over last night and was ticketed with HTA 172, I was going 157 on a 100 on 400N and was wondering what I should do. I was using cruise control but the guy in the lane to my left was driving into my lane irresponsibly to I sped up to get ahead of him and just my luck that's when an OPP cruiser pulled up behind me flashing his lights. My court date is at the end of the month…
If anyone can answer this I would greatly appreciate it.
Friday morning I checked my mail and received a letter from the MTO stating that under section 47(1) of the HTA the Registrar of Motor Vehicles has decided to suspend my driving privilege for medical reasons. This was due to a report submitted by a physician in compliance with section 203 of the HTA. Enclosed with that letter were forms to…
Ok so looking for some advice in regards to my wife's speeding ticket 120k in 100 (I was in vehicle so witnessed most - but was resting at initial clock.)
whats the likelihood of positive outcome of an 11b (or an officer no show, which I suspect doesn't really happen as much as web/Ads would have you believe) of 8months.
Wife REALLY doesn't want to go, and of course I'm the one doing all of the…
I know I shouldn't have driving but I slept at my buddies' place and I thought I was ok to drive in the morning.. needless to say I still drove and got pulled over.
Background details:
I was pulled over in the morning last week, apparently going 120 km/hr on 90km Northbound DVP. Two cop cars tailed me for a bit, saw them in my rearview mirror while on the left lane, slowed down to…
I got two tickets on Feb 20 2011. One for red light, and the other for Stop sign. I knew I had a good chance at getting off on the red light, because the officer couldn't actually see the light facing me. He was at an opposite angle, further up the street.
I set a court date for both tickets. On April 22 I moved to a new place. I went to the Service Ontario location and renewed my licence…
Winnipeg's police officers have been told to issue more traffic tickets, in part to increase revenue.
And a union representing cops says the move could hurt their efforts to curb the city's gang violence.
Police Chief Keith McCaskill said last night he -- and he alone, without input from Mayor Sam Katz -- recently made the call to patrolling officers and to those in specialized units to step up…
I'm wondering if anyone could enlighten me on what to do about the following scenario:
I was pulled over by a YRP constable because I only had one front head light working. Upon being pulled over, I also realized my insurance card was expired by one month and my car permit was not on me at all. (It doesn't matter now but my valid insurance card was sitting at home in an envelope…
I have a wicked prosecutor in my area, he is an evil man and will lie and cheat, whatever is necessary for him to win. I got a yellow light infraction ticket and the cop was a no show. I requested the charge dismissed and it went like this:
Me: I request the charge be dismissed because the officer is not here
Prosecutor: No, we are going to adjourn the trial so the officer can attend
Accident happened at a regular intersection with turning lanes and lights. I was turning left. The light turned yellow, and the car approaching sped up to make the light. I thought he was stopping, so i made the turn. At the time of the collision the light was red.
I understand that it is my fault. I'm just wondering what my best course of action is.
alright well to get started ive developed a passion for longboarding
for those of you who dont already know a longboard is a big skateboard too heavy for tricks and stuff but boy can they ever go fast
my hobbies include going up the escarpment here in hamilton and stoney creek and riding down the roads leading to the lower part of the city. just wondering here. what would happen if i was going down…
My court date is nearing at old city hall at appeals court.
iwhats going to happen and what do i do?
do I present my certificate of offence and point out to the judge the fine was incorrect, I did not appear and am now appealing on the grounds the Justice of the peace erred and failed to quash the ticket on the basis of the certificate not being properly examined and is not complete and regular on…
.