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Ontario Highway Traffic Act

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PostPosted: Mon Sep 13, 2010 9:03 am 
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Joined: Tue Feb 02, 2010 9:47 pm
Posts: 38
Just a funny thing I remember about my first "questionable" search.

Heading home for thanksgiving diner last year I stopped for a pee break on the 400. Upon entering my car again to leave I had an OPP cruiser pin me in from behind. He asked for my ID, asked me to get out of my car, another cruiser showed up, and finally he opened my back door and climbed in to do a search. This is when he asked if he may search my vehicle.

I told him that he may as well since he already was and didn't seem to care what my opinion was. I really get a kick out of messing with peace officers sometimes when I know i've done nothing wrong and was starting to crack up as he searched my car. He found a ghram cracker crumb on the floor and he examined that thouroughly. As well he found a spoon in the center console with some dried up apple sauce on it and asked me what I thought it was. Apparently he was on a drug search and I was weazing a bit from trying to stop my laughing. The cop was notably flushed and as he went to leave I asked why he searched my vehicle. Apparently I threw my dress shirt on my passenger seat in a rather conspicous manner, as if I wanted to hide drugs. I had a sort of exaggerated laugh when he said this and he did not stick around any longer.

I guess the other way to treat a situation like this is to have fun with it if you know you are not in the wrong. Maby not though. Just a story I thought might be interesting


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PostPosted: Mon Sep 13, 2010 9:57 pm 
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OPS Copper wrote:
My job is not to teach the kid his rights.

If I ask to search and he consents I am doing just that.

I know my rights and when I can search. I have a job to do and will do it.

Besides if anything is found and he is charged the courts will most likely toss the search anyways.

ops


I really, really want to be as respectful as possible here. I am NOT trying to be a ne'er do well or a jerk (see earlier posts); I would just like to ask a few questions and I genuinely hope that I do not offend you.

What sort of circumstances would be in play where you would ask for permission to do a search? Would you be playing a hunch or would you have something fairly close to "probable cause" to believe that the vehicle contained evidence that an offense had been committed? I guess that I'm asking: what sets off your radar?

If you believe that a court would most likely toss the search, what is the point of the search in the first place? Are you looking for something that would help you find a secondary route to the evidence that the court would toss?

Finally, and probably most contentiously, I understand that it is not your job to teach anyone his or her rights. But would it be particularly deleterious to the execution of your duty to let "the kid" know that he has options?

Again, I respect the job that you do and I am asking these questions because I am genuinely interested in your point of view.


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PostPosted: Tue Sep 14, 2010 2:59 pm 
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Joined: Thu Aug 27, 2009 10:06 pm
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When would I search or as to when to search? Well lets go back to the good kid from the beginning...

Perhaps he is not so clean cut. Perhaps he has been stopped in the past and drugs found on him or his friends. It could be that a joint was found either on him at school or if he was picked up for shop lifting. Perhaps he was with a friend who was a dealer and was stopped with him.

We keeps very good records about those things and they are available to me on the road.

We are taking the posters word that the kid was squeaky clean. People always scream that just as the hand cuffs go on them. There is a lot about your neighbors you do not know.

Some times it is just a feeling...based on the totality of the situation and not just one sign

Why would we search if it gets tossed...We most searches are tossed on obscure leaps of logic under the charter. ie one was tossed because a drug dog was walking past a closed trunk and got a drug hit... But even if a search is tossed the bad guys do not get their drugs or firearms back.

OPS


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 17, 2010 11:14 am 
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lots of consented searches get tossed in court. The man above is right, even if they find something it will likely get thrown out. Consent is usually determined to have been given under duress. (The guy had a gun, how could i say no?).

All i can say is, at least they were nice enough to ask.... Niagara cops didn't even give me that.

The answer is already here. Ask if you are being detained, then ask if you can speak to a lawyer. After that, hope for the best.


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PostPosted: Sun Sep 19, 2010 5:53 pm 
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ponyboyt wrote:
lots of consented searches get tossed in court. The man above is right, even if they find something it will likely get thrown out. Consent is usually determined to have been given under duress. (The guy had a gun, how could i say no?).

All i can say is, at least they were nice enough to ask.... Niagara cops didn't even give me that.

The answer is already here. Ask if you are being detained, then ask if you can speak to a lawyer. After that, hope for the best.


I probably should not scratch this open sore, but can you elaborate on the NRP searches you are aware of? They didn't even ask? Can't you tell them to just get stuffed? There has to be a way to stop clear violations of citizen's rights.


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 19, 2010 1:56 pm 
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Consent via coersion or intimidation "he had a gun, of course i said yes" is not informed consent.

But that will change. Now it will be "he had a tazer, of course i said yes". Because.... you know... a Judge in Niagara Falls said its ok to tazer people to compel them.


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