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Conviction HTA 32-9 with G-2 Licence
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 17, 2010 9:24 am 
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My son was convicted of Class G-2 Licence Contravention. His driver abstract from the MTO shows the violation and then a suspension for 7 months. It then shows the suspension was expired or rescinded, on the date it would have been reinstated according to the original suspension. It seems like a rather lengthy suspension for the above conviction. He has nothing else on his driver abstract.
When he plead gulity to driving in Contravention he understood that it would be 0 demerit points and no suspension just a fine. Can the MTO suspend your licence for any period they wish for the HTA 32-9 violation.
Thanks for any help.
Ed


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Re: Conviction HTA 32-9 with G-2 Licence
PostPosted: Wed Nov 17, 2010 10:09 am 
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Courts can not add demerit points (offences for those are HTA OREG 339/94) OR prevent suspensions as legislated in the HTA

MTO suspends licences as per direction/authority of the HTA

Novice (beginners) licence suspensions are in HTA OREG 340/94
9(5) MTO notifies person of suspension and time the suspension starts (usually notified by registered mail)
9(4) licence shall NOT be reinstated until 30 days AFTER the licence has been surrendered or up to a maximum of two years

Appears that the the letter was recieved indicating start of suspension date and the "surrender of licence" part was ignored for several months, then finally surrendered licence to which time the 30 day suspension began.

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Above is merely a suggestion/thought and in no way constitutes legal advice or views of my employer. www.OHTA.ca


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Re: Conviction HTA 32-9 with G-2 Licence
PostPosted: Wed Nov 17, 2010 10:58 am 
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Thanks for the information. I was trying to be brief in the posting, but if you do not mind reading this and letting me know your thoughts I would greatly appreciate it.
He was originally charged with BAC above 0 he was a .003 on the roadside screening device. He did nothing and was convicted in absentia. He then appealed the decision (it was allowed) and plead guilty to 32-9 Driving in Contravention.
Thanks to you I now understand that the MTO suspends based on the HTA. I do not know if 32-9 is a suspension offence.
If the suspension is proper and his abstract is correct, case closed for me. I just would like to be sure I understand the process and punishment as this has had a dramatic affect on Insurance premiums (naturally).
Any help is much appreciated,
Ed


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32-9 Clarification Question
PostPosted: Mon Nov 22, 2010 10:01 am 
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I am still a little unclear on the situation, so I am re posting with all the details that may be relevant. Any help would be greatly appreciated.
My son was convicted of Class G-2 Licence Contravention. He was originally charged with BAC above 0. He was a .003 on the roadside screening device. He missed his court date and was convicted in absentia. He then found out at the court that he was convicted and appealed the decision (it was allowed) and plead guilty to 32-9 Driving in Contravention. Paid the fine on time and thought this was the end of it.
His driver abstract from the MTO shows the violation and then a suspension for 7 months (he recieved no notice of suspension until getting an Insurance quote they informed him, that is why he got the abstract). It then shows the suspension was expired or rescinded, on the date it would have been reinstated according to the original suspension. It seems like a rather lengthy suspension for the above conviction. He has nothing else on his driver abstract.
When he plead guilty to driving in Contravention he understood form the prosecutor that it would be 0 demerit points and no suspension just a fine. Can the MTO suspend your licence for any period they wish for the HTA 32-9 violation?
I do not know if 32-9 is a suspension offence.
If the suspension is proper and his abstract is correct, case closed for me. I just would like to be sure I understand the process and punishment as this has had a dramatic affect on Insurance premiums (naturally).
Thanks for any help.
Ed


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Re: 32-9 Clarification Question
PostPosted: Mon Nov 22, 2010 12:43 pm 
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The MTO may suspend a licence for novice violations. I do not know if that is what happened here. It may have been a suspension for the 32(9) violation, which they are entitled to do, though 7 months does seem harsh. It also seems possible that the suspension was automatic upon conviction for BAC above 0 conviction and then when that conviction was overturned, no one told the MTO to revoke the suspension.

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Re: Conviction HTA 32-9 with G-2 Licence
PostPosted: Mon Nov 22, 2010 1:39 pm 
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Location: In YOUR rearview mirror!
ORGINAL POST and NEW CREATED POST by original poster MERGED together
***********************************************************************************

Driving in breach of condition prohibited
32 (9) No person shall drive a motor vehicle on a highway while contravening a condition contained in his or her driver’s licence or imposed by the regulations

Conditions for G2 are "imposed" by HTA OREG 340/94
6 (1)(1) BAC must be zero
9 (1) conviction of a violating any condition of under section 6 and the licence will be suspended

********************************
now I would sign a waiver that he will not operate my vehicle and have him removed from my insurance. Then get him a bicycle and/or bus pass.

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Re: Conviction HTA 32-9 with G-2 Licence
PostPosted: Mon Nov 22, 2010 5:12 pm 
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Thanks again for the information. So the appeal and subsquent guilty plea do not over ride the original conviction? I do not fully understand. I do understand the get a bike sentiment though!
Thanks,
Ed


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Re: Conviction HTA 32-9 with G-2 Licence
PostPosted: Mon Nov 22, 2010 6:09 pm 
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Euroed wrote:
So the appeal and subsquent guilty plea do not over ride the original conviction? I do not fully understand.

Ah, ok, understand a lot better now.

I can not find the proper area for your answer at the moment, but thinking there should be something written similiar to this below.....

Demerit point (HTA OREG 339/94)
5. (1) If a person convicted of an offence set out in Column 1 of the Table appeals the conviction and notice of the appeal is served on the Registrar, the conviction and the demerit points related to it shall not be entered on the person’s record unless the conviction is sustained on appeal
(2) If a conviction referred to in subsection (1) and related demerit points have been recorded prior to service of notice of an appeal on the Registrar, the conviction and demerit points shall be removed from the record, and any suspension imposed as a result of the conviction shall be stayed, as of the date notice is served on the Registrar, unless the conviction is sustained on appeal.

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Above is merely a suggestion/thought and in no way constitutes legal advice or views of my employer. www.OHTA.ca


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Re: Conviction HTA 32-9 with G-2 Licence
PostPosted: Mon Nov 22, 2010 6:16 pm 
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Ed,

think I just found the answer at HTA 55
**********************************
Suspension on appeal
55. If a person whose licence has been suspended enters an appeal against his or her conviction and serves notice of the appeal on the Registrar, the suspension is stayed from the time notice is served on the Registrar unless the conviction is sustained on appeal.
**********************************
Now, I'm no legal print person here, but appears not only do you have to appeal to the court on the conviction, you also have to serve notice of the appeal to the MTO (Register).

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Above is merely a suggestion/thought and in no way constitutes legal advice or views of my employer. www.OHTA.ca


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Re: Conviction HTA 32-9 with G-2 Licence
PostPosted: Tue Nov 23, 2010 9:01 am 
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That is very helpfiul. Thanks for all the work. He has all the records from the court and has contacted the ministry and they will not change it. This is why I am confused. It seems to me that if he appeals (he had no idea he would have to inform the MTO, neither would I have) and gets the charges reduced (I suppose it is better then BAC over 0 to have driving in contravention) and can produce all the documents the MTO should adjust his abstract. They will not speak to anyone but him, so I rely on him when he says they refuse to change it. Do you have any suggestions on what to do now? Once again, thanks for all the help.
Ed


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Re: Conviction HTA 32-9 with G-2 Licence
PostPosted: Fri Nov 26, 2010 9:55 am 
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if they are being stuborn on the phone, forget the phone. Send it in writing. The legal way - registered mail, track it, request the changes and provide copies of the relevent paper work.


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Re: Conviction HTA 32-9 with G-2 Licence
PostPosted: Sun Nov 28, 2010 6:27 pm 
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Thanks, that is likely the best we can hope for.
Ed


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