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PostPosted: Wed Sep 30, 2009 3:45 pm 
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Squishy wrote:
"Published in Canada by [Carswell?]..." What does that mean?

It probably means they're trying to fool us. Carswell is a Canadian publisher that specializes in legal materials. By saying one of their titles is "Published in Canada" they're likely tippy-toeing around making it too clear that it was printed in another country: i.e., they saved fifty cents a copy by seeing to it that no Canadian printer got the work. That's what I think when I see a statement like that on a publication -- but I may be biased because of my 30+ years in the printing business here.


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 30, 2009 5:11 pm 
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That's what I was thinking as well, kind of like the "Printed in Canada" labels on things that aren't even printed (just the package).

Bear, does the back of your notebook still say "Complaint" instead of "Compliant" (page 5 of the blue text)? This latest batch fixed that for me, but they've spelled "able to breath" instead of "breathe" in the First Aid notes. No good Canadian would make those kinds of mistakes. :P

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 30, 2009 11:24 pm 
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hwybear wrote:
I know my work shirts are "made in china"


From where I work:

- Uniform is made in Canada, but the fabric is from China :shock:
- Company-issued briefcase is made in Canada, not sure about where the cows are from
- Company manuals are printed in Canada, but the binders are from Taiwan :?
- The airplanes were made in Canada, so were the engines (Bombardier, Pratt & Whitney) :D


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 06, 2009 7:07 pm 
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The company I work for (medical equipment) is slowly sliding down the cheapness scale. Manufacturing has gone from Canada (1940-1970), to US, (1970-2006) to Mexico (2006-Present). The competition went from USA to China a few years ago.

-PbFoot


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 07, 2009 3:53 pm 
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I noticed that Canadian Tire has started carrying Pure Energy rechargeables manufactured in Nova Scotia. Relabled as "Green Earth" or something like that and marketed as a green alternative to NiMHs. Good that a Canadian manufacturer is getting more market share, but wow BAD marketing move. I have a feeling that they will get a very bad reputation unless they include some sort of handout on different battery chemistries near the flashlight/battery rack. How many people will even notice that it needs a special alkaline battery charger, much less know the limited applications for such a battery?

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PostPosted: Thu Oct 08, 2009 11:02 pm 
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Squishy wrote:
How many people will even notice that it needs a special alkaline battery charger, much less know the limited applications for such a battery?


Probably none... heck, I wouldn't even know. If I saw a rechargable battery I'd be inclined to take a quick glance at the fine print and then buy it. That, of course, could result in some really interesting results when I'd try to charge the battery. :shock:


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 10, 2009 9:20 am 
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I took a look at their battery charger packaging, and it looks exactly like the battery cell packaging. At first I thought it was just a larger "club pack" or something like that.

I think their downfall will be from people stuffing those inside their cameras. They will last about 10 pictures and then leak all over their nice digital camera.

For anyone interested in the differences between chemistries, I shall go into Battery Professor mode:

Alkalines - good for low-drain applications, as internal resistance increases proportionally to current (the higher the current, the less effective capacity remains). In rechargeable cells, they work best if used in a situation where they can be regularly topped up, such as computer mice, electric toothbrushes, etc. For things like clocks and remote controls, while low-drain, you don't really think to take the batteries out and recharge them until they stop working - so I would stick with primary (non-rechargeable) cells. Rechargeable alkalines require a special alkaline charger (some of Pure Energy's chargers can handle both alkalines and NiMHs).

NiMH - good for high-current applications such as digital cameras, electric screwdrivers, flashlights, etc., but they have a high rate of self-discharge, making them inferior to alkalines when used in low-current applications, as the battery will discharge itself before the device gets much use out of them. Thus, you should be recharging them before each use. Some chemistries also like to be conditioned once in a while (full discharge followed by full recharge).
--LSD NiMH - this new type of cell confused the line between the different alkaline/NiMH applications. Low Self-Discharge NiMHs come marked as "hybrid" or "pre-charged" batteries, and can be stored months or even years with a usable charge, just like alkalines, but also have the high-current drain abilities of NiMHs. I would use these for emergency flashlights and anything else you have that is high-current but is inconvenient to recharge before use. There is a slight capacity tradeoff compared to traditional NiMHs.

Lithium, Lithium-Ion, Lithium-Polymer - I've just started playing with these, so don't know much about them yet. My new flashlight uses lithium cobalt ion cells, which supposedly have the energy density of TNT, so I'm doing a lot of research and pointing them away from my face and tender bits for the time being. They seem to behave like NiMHs but have much higher capactiy, as well as a higher voltage. I don't think these are ready for mainstream consumer use yet, as it is very important to keep cells matched - different cells will have different discharge rates, even ones from the same factory but made on different days. Once the voltages are imbalanced, one cell will try to charge the other, overheating it and resulting in a "vent-with-flame" incident, where the cell vents hydrogen gas and ignites it. I have read of one case where a LEO holding a lithium-powered tactical flashlight had it blow up in his hands because his 123A cells were likely imbalanced. Same applies to lithium-powered digital cameras, though laptop batteries and "packs" usually have some sort of cell balancing circuit to prevent this. If you do have a digital camera that takes 123A cells, get them from a flashlight store like 4sevens.ca - you can find them for $1-2 a cell compared to $10 in a department store.

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PostPosted: Sat Oct 10, 2009 2:05 pm 
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Well done, Dr. Squishy, PhD (Batt.Chem.)! Thanks. I'd happily go into Whatever Professor mode myself in return, if only I were an expert in anything in which anyone here (or, essentially, anywhere else) might have the slightest interest.


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 10, 2009 5:02 pm 
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Squishy wrote:
I took a look at their battery charger packaging, and it looks exactly like the battery cell packaging. At first I thought it was just a larger "club pack" or something like that.

I think their downfall will be from people stuffing those inside their cameras. They will last about 10 pictures and then leak all over their nice digital camera.

For anyone interested in the differences between chemistries, I shall go into Battery Professor mode:

Alkalines - good for low-drain applications, as internal resistance increases proportionally to current (the higher the current, the less effective capacity remains). In rechargeable cells, they work best if used in a situation where they can be regularly topped up, such as computer mice, electric toothbrushes, etc. For things like clocks and remote controls, while low-drain, you don't really think to take the batteries out and recharge them until they stop working - so I would stick with primary (non-rechargeable) cells. Rechargeable alkalines require a special alkaline charger (some of Pure Energy's chargers can handle both alkalines and NiMHs).

NiMH - good for high-current applications such as digital cameras, electric screwdrivers, flashlights, etc., but they have a high rate of self-discharge, making them inferior to alkalines when used in low-current applications, as the battery will discharge itself before the device gets much use out of them. Thus, you should be recharging them before each use. Some chemistries also like to be conditioned once in a while (full discharge followed by full recharge).
--LSD NiMH - this new type of cell confused the line between the different alkaline/NiMH applications. Low Self-Discharge NiMHs come marked as "hybrid" or "pre-charged" batteries, and can be stored months or even years with a usable charge, just like alkalines, but also have the high-current drain abilities of NiMHs. I would use these for emergency flashlights and anything else you have that is high-current but is inconvenient to recharge before use. There is a slight capacity tradeoff compared to traditional NiMHs.

Lithium, Lithium-Ion, Lithium-Polymer - I've just started playing with these, so don't know much about them yet. My new flashlight uses lithium cobalt ion cells, which supposedly have the energy density of TNT, so I'm doing a lot of research and pointing them away from my face and tender bits for the time being. They seem to behave like NiMHs but have much higher capactiy, as well as a higher voltage. I don't think these are ready for mainstream consumer use yet, as it is very important to keep cells matched - different cells will have different discharge rates, even ones from the same factory but made on different days. Once the voltages are imbalanced, one cell will try to charge the other, overheating it and resulting in a "vent-with-flame" incident, where the cell vents hydrogen gas and ignites it. I have read of one case where a LEO holding a lithium-powered tactical flashlight had it blow up in his hands because his 123A cells were likely imbalanced. Same applies to lithium-powered digital cameras, though laptop batteries and "packs" usually have some sort of cell balancing circuit to prevent this. If you do have a digital camera that takes 123A cells, get them from a flashlight store like 4sevens.ca - you can find them for $1-2 a cell compared to $10 in a department store.


Alkaline rechargeables can give you a decent performance even in cameras. They are higher capacity than NiCad batteries actually, but worse than NiMH.

Anyone remember the Sony fiasco when 10 million laptops were recalled due to fear of explosion? Or the recent iPhone 3GS exploding on people while in phone call? Those are Lithium-types though.

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PostPosted: Sat Oct 10, 2009 5:18 pm 
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Here, I found something about the issues with exploding 123 lithium batteris too :lol:

http://www.engadget.com/2007/07/18/coun ... re-hazard/

Quote:
Unfortunately for those 4,400 or so owners of the Xenon Aluminum flashlight sold at Sportsman's Warehouse, the recall wagon has come your way, and unless you have no fear of exploding batteries, we'd suggest you power it off at your earliest convenience. Interestingly enough, this case involves more than just a faulty design, as the Panasonic CR123A Industrial Lithium batteries packed within are believed to be counterfeits, and it comes as no surprise that these knockoffs "can overheat and rupture, posing a fire and burn hazard to consumers."

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PostPosted: Mon Oct 12, 2009 12:29 am 
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Alkalines will work well in a camera only if you use it without a flash, or your flash charges with a low current drain. An alkaline's capacity varies based on current drain, so a few repeated high-current flash charges will deplete the battery pretty quickly and eventually make it leak..

I remember those recalls. Sony makes one of the better Li-Ion cells, but I think most of the problems were caused by shorts internal to the pack (external to the cell), bypassing the protection circuit. "Pack" problems are relatively rare due to the protection circuits, but cameras and flashlights use individual cells. Most of those consumer-level cells have a small protection circuit built into the negative end of the cell, but you can get unprotected cells if you specifically order them, or if you go with cheap, off-brand cells. Those cells can give off more current, but require extra care and periodic testing.

Panasonic has the only 123A manufacturing facility in North America, so I imagine they have the most counterfeits for the "Made in USA" label. That link forgets to mention that the cells can explode whether the device is on or not, so it would be best to completely remove suspect cells instead of just turning it off.

This is the recent LEO incident I was talking about:
http://www.khou.com/news/local/stories/ ... 746a5.html
http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/met ... 52786.html

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PostPosted: Mon Oct 12, 2009 11:23 am 
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Squishy wrote:
Once the voltages are imbalanced, one cell will try to charge the other, overheating it and resulting in a "vent-with-flame" incident, where the cell vents hydrogen gas and ignites it.


That's also why there are restrictions on carrying lithium batteries onto passenger aircraft. :shock:


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Re: Triform using cheaper cows?
PostPosted: Mon Oct 12, 2009 5:58 pm 
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In 2007-8, nickel was at $20 to $25 a pound. Nickel coins today are not make of pure nickel, however, certain older nickel coins still in cirulation are.

A 5 cent nickel coin was worth 20 cents, or whatever it was, due to the nickel content. Most nickel coins in the USA are still pure or almost pure nickel.

Wise guys were melting down the nickel coins and making a large profit on resale of the nickel community.

The US government (and maybe even Canadian) passed a law making it illegal to melt down their coins.

racer wrote:
Squishy wrote:
When did their leather notebook covers get so flimsy? My old one is so much more..."supple" than the new ones I just got. Hmph I feel cheated. :x


When a penny became worth more than it is worth.

(Currently, it costs 3.9 cents to mint a penny)


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 13, 2009 7:26 am 
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Greatest Canadian wrote:
The US government (and maybe even Canadian) passed a law making it illegal to melt down their coins.


As long as I remember, it has always been illegal to willfully destroy currency of any type.

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PostPosted: Tue Oct 13, 2009 6:37 pm 
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Reflections wrote:
As long as I remember, it has always been illegal to willfully destroy currency of any type.


Hey, what about lighting up a fat Cuban cigar with a Benjamin Franklin?

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