Hey everyone, I need help with a speeding ticket and requesting disclosure. First some context: I received a speeding ticket last February heading eastbound on the 401, just east of Cornwall. The OPP officer pulled me over, told me that he had me going 31 to 35 km over the speed limit, then gave me a ticket for going 135km in a 100km zone. He didn't mention anything about the instrument he used (radar, lidar etc). I described the situation to another police officer who said that he likely paced me (he was beside me, then slowed down, came into my lane behind me and turned on his lights – I seriously doubt he paced me long enough to get an accurate read on my speed). Anyways, I asked for the ticket to be taken to trial, and last week received a court date for early July. This leaves me about 5-6 weeks to request disclosure and prepare myself. I'm going to fax in a disclosure request form tomorrow, however I'm worried that it's not going to be enough time for them to get me the disclosure, and I'm feeling kind of cheated that they only left me 6 weeks to ask for disclosure and prepare. I live in Toronto and the trial is taking place in Cornwall. I understand that I can show up and say that I didn't receive my disclosure and have the trial adjourned, but that would require me to make multiple trips to Cornwall for this. Does anyone have any advice/tips with this? Is this standard practice with Cornwall? Also, what should I mention in particular in the disclosure? I'm going to use the standard template from ticketcombat (http://ticketcombat.com/step4/disclosurehow.php) - is there anything else that I should ask for? Make/model and manual for radar gun used? Calibration records? Or is all that information provided with disclosure? This is my first time fighting a ticket so any advice (regardless of how common sense it seems) is greatly appreciated. Thanks!
Topic
Ticket for 35km over, help with disclosure appreciated!
But how am I expected to properly cross-examine the officer if I dont have knowledge about the radar, and how do I gain this knowledge without being provided with the manual? Seeing the manual for a couple minutes prior to the trial doesn't give me enough time to properly build my case and cross-examine the officer.
Decatur wrote:
Radar make, model and serial number were all provided in the officers notes.
Don't expect to get the radar manual, it usually isn't provided. The most you'll get will be the testing instructions and probably an opportunity to view the manual. If you dont get the additional disclosure about two weeks before trial, the best you can hope for is an adjournment to another date.
But how am I expected to properly cross-examine the officer if I dont have knowledge about the radar, and how do I gain this knowledge without being provided with the manual? Seeing the manual for a couple minutes prior to the trial doesn't give me enough time to properly build my case and cross-examine the officer.
I've been doing some reading on possible strategies. If I dont receive the officers typed notes in time (eg >2 weeks prior to the trial), would I have a shot at filing a stay of proceedings?
I've been doing some reading on possible strategies. If I dont receive the officers typed notes in time (eg >2 weeks prior to the trial), would I have a shot at filing a stay of proceedings?
That is exactly the argument you need to bring up before the trial starts, so you have a good reason to appeal if you lose at the trial.
confused23 wrote:
But how am I expected to properly cross-examine the officer if I dont have knowledge about the radar, and how do I gain this knowledge without being provided with the manual? Seeing the manual for a couple minutes prior to the trial doesn't give me enough time to properly build my case and cross-examine the officer.
That is exactly the argument you need to bring up before the trial starts, so you have a good reason to appeal if you lose at the trial.
Personally I think it's wrong that they don't disclose the complete manual. They don't disclose because they dont want you to know how it works. In my case they said it was copyright infringement. I brought the issue before the judge and add a result, an officer volunteered to sit with me and allow me to read the manual. If you have a good reason to see the manual then ask the judge. If he says no then you may have ground for appeal. In the end, your job is to make life difficult for the crown and the officer. The crown in my area would rather withdraw charge then be embarrassed by well prepared defendant. Sadly however you are looking at multiple trips to Cornwall. You'll probably need to appear when you ask the judge to disclose the manual. Then you'll need to appear again to ask for more time because the crown disclosed it two days before the trial. Then a third time when your ready for trial. If you lose, you'll need to appear again to ask for an appeal. And then finally the appeal. 5 trips or so. What would be your defense?
Personally I think it's wrong that they don't disclose the complete manual. They don't disclose because they dont want you to know how it works. In my case they said it was copyright infringement. I brought the issue before the judge and add a result, an officer volunteered to sit with me and allow me to read the manual. If you have a good reason to see the manual then ask the judge. If he says no then you may have ground for appeal. In the end, your job is to make life difficult for the crown and the officer. The crown in my area would rather withdraw charge then be embarrassed by well prepared defendant. Sadly however you are looking at multiple trips to Cornwall. You'll probably need to appear when you ask the judge to disclose the manual. Then you'll need to appear again to ask for more time because the crown disclosed it two days before the trial. Then a third time when your ready for trial. If you lose, you'll need to appear again to ask for an appeal. And then finally the appeal. 5 trips or so.
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