Hi Gang. I'm back, but I'm asking for a friend this time. A friend received a ticket the other day for driving 87 km/h in a 70 km/h zone. The problem is it's a posted 80 zone (I've verified this fact with him). Is an incorrectly identified speed limit a fatal error? There isn't a police officer in the province who would stop a driver who's only 7 km/h over the limit, so if the officer had realized it was an 80 zone, my friend would never have been stopped. If he goes to court, and the prosecutor is unwilling to withdraw the charge over the error (assuming it's not a fatal error), my friend could still conceivably be convicted in a situation in which he would never have been charged initially.
Hi Gang. I'm back, but I'm asking for a friend this time.
A friend received a ticket the other day for driving 87 km/h in a 70 km/h zone. The problem is it's a posted 80 zone (I've verified this fact with him). Is an incorrectly identified speed limit a fatal error? There isn't a police officer in the province who would stop a driver who's only 7 km/h over the limit, so if the officer had realized it was an 80 zone, my friend would never have been stopped. If he goes to court, and the prosecutor is unwilling to withdraw the charge over the error (assuming it's not a fatal error), my friend could still conceivably be convicted in a situation in which he would never have been charged initially.
Remember that they are not charged for the place where they are pulled over, but wherever the officer saw them speeding. Is there a 70 zone before the 80 zone where the officer could have seen them speeding? Anyways if it is an 80 zone, then the charge is incorrect and it should be withdrawn. But your friend will need proof of it being an 80 zone. So pics of signs leading into the area from both directions and possible a google maps printout that they can show the area on. They still need to get disclosure though first before any of this can be decided for sure. They should plead Not Guilty and request a trial with the officer present. Once they get their notice of trial they should request disclosure (officers notes, manual for speed measuring device). Once they get the notes, scan and post here so we can give some more specific advice.
Remember that they are not charged for the place where they are pulled over, but wherever the officer saw them speeding. Is there a 70 zone before the 80 zone where the officer could have seen them speeding?
Anyways if it is an 80 zone, then the charge is incorrect and it should be withdrawn. But your friend will need proof of it being an 80 zone. So pics of signs leading into the area from both directions and possible a google maps printout that they can show the area on.
They still need to get disclosure though first before any of this can be decided for sure.
They should plead Not Guilty and request a trial with the officer present. Once they get their notice of trial they should request disclosure (officers notes, manual for speed measuring device). Once they get the notes, scan and post here so we can give some more specific advice.
I think, depending on the mood of the officer, they could very well do so. You know that +1 over the limit is speeding A friend of mine was ticketed by radar for 3 MPH over (back home) but as you say, it was an 80 not a 70, someone with more experience will come along to confirm if it is a fatal
I think, depending on the mood of the officer, they could very well do so.
You know that +1 over the limit is speeding
A friend of mine was ticketed by radar for 3 MPH over (back home)
but as you say, it was an 80 not a 70,
someone with more experience will come along to confirm if it is a fatal
Zatota wrote:
Hi Gang. I'm back, but I'm asking for a friend this time.
A friend received a ticket the other day for driving 87 km/h in a 70 km/h zone. The problem is it's a posted 80 zone (I've verified this fact with him). Is an incorrectly identified speed limit a fatal error? There isn't a police officer in the province who would stop a driver who's only 7 km/h over the limit, so if the officer had realized it was an 80 zone, my friend would never have been stopped. If he goes to court, and the prosecutor is unwilling to withdraw the charge over the error (assuming it's not a fatal error), my friend could still conceivably be convicted in a situation in which he would never have been charged initially.
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* NO you cant touch your phone
* Speeding is speeding
* Challenge every ticket
* Impaired driving, you should be locked up UNDER the jail
My understanding is that they can amend the speed you were travelling but not the "in a posted zone" part. Of course I could be wrong about that, but even if not fatal, it is still the incorrect charge. Anyways, most important thing you can do is NOT tell the prosecutor there is an error. If you tell them, then they can fix it. Don't tell them!!! Then I would proceed with getting disclosure. If the officers notes also say it was in a 70 zone then there is a good chance to beat it. If the officers notes say it was in an 80 then it will be much harder to beat.
My understanding is that they can amend the speed you were travelling but not the "in a posted zone" part. Of course I could be wrong about that, but even if not fatal, it is still the incorrect charge.
Anyways, most important thing you can do is NOT tell the prosecutor there is an error. If you tell them, then they can fix it. Don't tell them!!!
Then I would proceed with getting disclosure. If the officers notes also say it was in a 70 zone then there is a good chance to beat it. If the officers notes say it was in an 80 then it will be much harder to beat.
Section 34 of the Provincial Offences Act: Amendment of information or certificate 34. (1) The court may, at any stage of the proceeding, amend the information or certificate as may be necessary if it appears that the information or certificate, (a) fails to state or states defectively anything that is requisite to charge the offence; (b) does not negative an exception that should be negatived; or (c) is in any way defective in substance or in form. It is not an incorrect charge...He was charged with speeding for going faster than the speed limit...how is it the wrong charge...
Section 34 of the Provincial Offences Act: Amendment of information or certificate
34. (1) The court may, at any stage of the proceeding, amend the information or certificate as may be necessary if it appears that the information or certificate,
(a) fails to state or states defectively anything that is requisite to charge the offence;
(b) does not negative an exception that should be negatived; or
(c) is in any way defective in substance or in form.
It is not an incorrect charge...He was charged with speeding for going faster than the speed limit...how is it the wrong charge...
It is the wrong charge if he was charged for speeding in a 70 zone when it was actually an 80 zone. And just a reminder that even a Speeding 7-over charge (which is 0 demerits) is still considered a MINOR offence by insurance company and can cause your insurance to go up. Anyways, get disclosure notes and post them and we can advise further.
It is the wrong charge if he was charged for speeding in a 70 zone when it was actually an 80 zone.
And just a reminder that even a Speeding 7-over charge (which is 0 demerits) is still considered a MINOR offence by insurance company and can cause your insurance to go up.
Anyways, get disclosure notes and post them and we can advise further.
He's smart enough not to say anything until he gets his disclosure and shows up in court. It's an 80 for at least a couple of kilometres and doesn't become a 70 until about 500 metres past where the officer stopped him. He's printed a Google Maps layout of the area and has indicated the locations of all speed limit signs; he also has photos of them to cross-reference. It would be annoying if the charge isn't withdrawn. Why should he be convicted of driving 7 km/h over the limit and face the insurance consequences when no officer in the province would pull him over for that amount? Part of me feels there has to be a precedent somewhere. Otherwise, what's to stop an officer from pulling someone over at, say, 81 in an 80 zone and "accidentally" noting the limit as 40 on the ticket? The driver goes to court, the prosecutor says "Oops" and amends the charge to read 81 in an 80 zone. That's still a conviction and the driver faces the same insurance ding as if he'd been 40 over. At any rate, he's sent in his trial request. We'll see what happens.
He's smart enough not to say anything until he gets his disclosure and shows up in court.
It's an 80 for at least a couple of kilometres and doesn't become a 70 until about 500 metres past where the officer stopped him. He's printed a Google Maps layout of the area and has indicated the locations of all speed limit signs; he also has photos of them to cross-reference.
It would be annoying if the charge isn't withdrawn. Why should he be convicted of driving 7 km/h over the limit and face the insurance consequences when no officer in the province would pull him over for that amount? Part of me feels there has to be a precedent somewhere. Otherwise, what's to stop an officer from pulling someone over at, say, 81 in an 80 zone and "accidentally" noting the limit as 40 on the ticket? The driver goes to court, the prosecutor says "Oops" and amends the charge to read 81 in an 80 zone. That's still a conviction and the driver faces the same insurance ding as if he'd been 40 over.
At any rate, he's sent in his trial request. We'll see what happens.
Some stories do have happy endings. My friend received a notice in the mail saying that, because of an error on the ticket, the charge is being withdrawn. Someone was in a good mood!
Some stories do have happy endings.
My friend received a notice in the mail saying that, because of an error on the ticket, the charge is being withdrawn. Someone was in a good mood!
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