Disobey Officer directing traffic.

Karen V
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Disobey Officer directing traffic.

Unread post by Karen V on

Ticket received in Parking Lot of Mall. Officer sitting in cruiser looking down toward lap. Cruiser parked on an angle allowing access to turn to the left. I stopped proceeded to the left to turn at the next intersection. After I passed the cruiser and was a least a full car length passed him he honked his horn. I continued to the next intersection in the parking lot turned around and returned to the officer. He asked me why I didn't stop when he honked the horn. I told him wanted to safely turn around in a forward motion instead of backing up. Ticket was issued. The officer was not out of the vehicle directing traffic, he was sitting in the cruiser with his eyes focused on something in his lap. He was supposedly securing a fire scene. A tractor trailer cab had burnt in the parking lot and the fire had been distinguished. I was unaware of the incident as the firetruck was present and obstructed my view. I truly thoght that there had been an accident at the stoplight that was to my right, that is why I proceeded to my left to turn around.


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Simon Borys
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Unread post by Simon Borys on

That's not likely to stick.
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Unread post by Traffic Law on

Winable case. I could have lots of fun with this one.


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hwybear
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Unread post by hwybear on

perhaps the poster can post the road name, municipality so that a google maps search can reveal where this happened.....without it is jumping to conclusions.

I have blocked roads by parking a cruiser x-ways lights activated....only to have vehicles go around the front and rear of the cruiser via sholuder, extra lane, ditch etc...as the car is only so long...... plus sometimes we are equipped with pylons to "extent" the car...only to have people drive thru those too.....all this while waiting for the roads department to bring in full barriers (yes people drive around those too) just sayin
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Unread post by viper1 on

I thought I had seen everything.

WOW

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Unread post by pvotrainer on

The officer has to give a "direction" for this charge to stick. Using the car to block the road does not count either as the HTA specifies the signs and or barracades that must be used. the officer was just lazy at the time. Also, you said you received the ticket in a parking lot. Section 134 only applies when on a highway (road, street, etc). It is not valid on private property such as a mall lot. Receiving the ticket there is ok as long as the offence took place on the highway.


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Simon Borys
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Unread post by Simon Borys on

There may be an argument to be made for receiving a ticket in a mall parking lot or similar place. The definition of highway in the HTA is:

“highway” includes a common and public highway, street, avenue, parkway, driveway, square, place, bridge, viaduct or trestle, any part of which is intended for or used by the general public for the passage of vehicles and includes the area between the lateral property lines thereof

One could argue that the nature of the mall, and the corresponding parking lot, is such that the public has an open invitation to access, without the need for an express invitation, such as you might expect on other types of "private property", like your own driveway or a business's secured parking lot. This, arguably, would allow it to meet the definition of highway.
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hwybear
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Unread post by hwybear on

pvotrainer wrote:The officer has to give a "direction" for this charge to stick. Using the car to block the road does not count either as the HTA specifies the signs and or barracades that must be used. the officer was just lazy at the time. Also, you said you received the ticket in a parking lot. Section 134 only applies when on a highway (road, street, etc). It is not valid on private property such as a mall lot. Receiving the ticket there is ok as long as the offence took place on the highway.
HTA 134 (2) specifies to close a highway that a sign OR traffic control devices be used, not for directing of traffic.
HTA 134 (1)makes no reference to the offence having to be on a highway.
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Unread post by pvotrainer on

the HTA only applies to a highway, except in the instance of reporting a collision. for the police tossue a ticket for an offence under the HTA the offence must have taken place on a highway. Aimple definition of a highway is everything between the propety lines of the roadway, ( ifence to fence in the country, store front to store front downtown Toronto) The width of a standard highway is 33 feet from the centre of the road. if you live in a detached home, walk out to the front yard and find the water shutoff. That's the edge of the highway.

As for a mall parking lot, trying to get it included under the HTA has failed at each attempt. While the definition seems confusing, the courts are clear. It does not apply


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Unread post by pvotrainer on

Hwybear, you are correct about section 134(2) is for closing a highway. 134 refers to the Regulations. The regulation it refers to describes what must be used to close a highway and a car is not included. Traffic cones (pylons) no entry sign, and saw horse style barracades are. Without using what is specified means no offence has been committed. Section 134(1) applies when an officer is directing traffic, such as in an intersection


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Unread post by hwybear on

pvotrainer wrote:the HTA only applies to a highway, except in the instance of reporting a collision. for the police tossue a ticket for an offence under the HTA the offence must have taken place on a highway. Aimple definition of a highway is everything between the propety lines of the roadway, ( ifence to fence in the country, store front to store front downtown Toronto) The width of a standard highway is 33 feet from the centre of the road. if you live in a detached home, walk out to the front yard and find the water shutoff. That's the edge of the highway.

As for a mall parking lot, trying to get it included under the HTA has failed at each attempt. While the definition seems confusing, the courts are clear. It does not apply
I have been doing this for "many moons" and know highway definition etc...I do no think the original poster described the area well enough, as is indicating there is stoplights in vicinity. Would have been better with a actual street/mall address so we could all google map and see what it is about...just sayin

Can also direct traffic with the cruiser, such as closing down one lane of traffic for a collision.....it is not a closed hwy as a lane is still open




Above is merely a suggestion/thought and in no way constitutes legal advice or views of my employer. www.OHTA.ca


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