Last weekend, I got a speeding ticket on the 401, outside of Woodstock. I live in Toronto. I was in the very left hand lane, given a ticket for going 38 km/h over the posted speed limit, according to the radar. The guy in front of me was going the same speed as well (as was other traffic in that lane), but they got lucky. The ticket is $228 "set fine" and then it says $283 "total payable" (wtf? talk about ripping you off with all these "applicable victim fine surcharge and costs" for which no breakdown is provided?!). Anyway, obviously my main concern is my insurance rates going up (and also this fine is pricey), and my experience with tickets is that if you go to court, your ticket can get reduced, etc. if you plead guilty. However, I understand that a conviction at all will mark your driving record, so it is better to plead not guilty and see if something can be done. Some background is that I was convicted of a speeding ticket on the Allen at the end of 2012 (I forget the speed, but it was probably 15-20km/h over or something - you know how everyone goes 100km on that road..). I did all the steps of filing for disclosure, etc. and could not find any holes in it.. although the cop gave me the documents that same day, if I remember correctly. In the end, I just pleaded guilty and had my fine reduced, along with no demerit points because it was recorded as a reduced # of km over the speed limit. So this is already on my record. Other than that, I only have one minor at fault collision from a few years ago (broke her rear light and some scratch/dent on her car) and 2 not-at-fault collisions, none of which seemed to impact my insurance at all - in fact, my insurance rate went down (perhaps the person did not end up taking it to her insurance company). The major issue is that the place to file for a court date is in Cambridge, so it will be a 1-1.5 hour drive out there in the middle of the week, necessitating half a day off work (luckily, my work is flexible with time off). I am wondering what people would advise I do. Is it worthwhile to take this to court and file, pleading not guilty, and go through all the steps with disclosure, etc. in case there are major holes in the evidence, or the cop doesn't show up in court, or they take forever to grant me a court date and I can argue on the basis an 11(b).. or do those latter 2 things even happen in Cambridge? Maybe it is not as busy as in Toronto? Or should I just speak to a prosecutor in an early resolution meeting (I understand this can be done by phone if I live more than 75 km/h from the court house, which I do) and try to get the fine reduced? What else can I speak to the prosecutor about? The back of the ticket says "by choosing this option, you do not forego the right to a trial." What kind of impact will this have on my driving record and insurance? I have to file something or pay the fine by the end of this week. Thanks!
Last weekend, I got a speeding ticket on the 401, outside of Woodstock. I live in Toronto. I was in the very left hand lane, given a ticket for going 38 km/h over the posted speed limit, according to the radar. The guy in front of me was going the same speed as well (as was other traffic in that lane), but they got lucky. The ticket is $228 "set fine" and then it says $283 "total payable" (wtf? talk about ripping you off with all these "applicable victim fine surcharge and costs" for which no breakdown is provided?!). Anyway, obviously my main concern is my insurance rates going up (and also this fine is pricey), and my experience with tickets is that if you go to court, your ticket can get reduced, etc. if you plead guilty. However, I understand that a conviction at all will mark your driving record, so it is better to plead not guilty and see if something can be done. Some background is that I was convicted of a speeding ticket on the Allen at the end of 2012 (I forget the speed, but it was probably 15-20km/h over or something - you know how everyone goes 100km on that road..). I did all the steps of filing for disclosure, etc. and could not find any holes in it.. although the cop gave me the documents that same day, if I remember correctly. In the end, I just pleaded guilty and had my fine reduced, along with no demerit points because it was recorded as a reduced # of km over the speed limit. So this is already on my record. Other than that, I only have one minor at fault collision from a few years ago (broke her rear light and some scratch/dent on her car) and 2 not-at-fault collisions, none of which seemed to impact my insurance at all - in fact, my insurance rate went down (perhaps the person did not end up taking it to her insurance company).
The major issue is that the place to file for a court date is in Cambridge, so it will be a 1-1.5 hour drive out there in the middle of the week, necessitating half a day off work (luckily, my work is flexible with time off). I am wondering what people would advise I do. Is it worthwhile to take this to court and file, pleading not guilty, and go through all the steps with disclosure, etc. in case there are major holes in the evidence, or the cop doesn't show up in court, or they take forever to grant me a court date and I can argue on the basis an 11(b).. or do those latter 2 things even happen in Cambridge? Maybe it is not as busy as in Toronto?
Or should I just speak to a prosecutor in an early resolution meeting (I understand this can be done by phone if I live more than 75 km/h from the court house, which I do) and try to get the fine reduced? What else can I speak to the prosecutor about? The back of the ticket says "by choosing this option, you do not forego the right to a trial."
What kind of impact will this have on my driving record and insurance?
I have to file something or pay the fine by the end of this week.
The insurance companies have to pay for your driving abstracts, and they do this around the time of your renewal. If you've had a clean record for several years, the insurance company loses money paying for your abstract... so they choose not to get it. That money can be better spent on an at/higher risk driver (ie. male, 16yr, brampton, speeding, at-fault accident). You'll have to look at your insurance policy, some people get conviction free discounts of 15%. If you get convicted for speeding, you'll lose those discounts and they may add another +10% per conviction. State Farm cancels policies on a third minor conviction within a three year window. It's always better to request disclosure, and request a trial to maximize your opportunities of having the charges withdrawn due to technicalities. You'll have to look at your finances, and decide whether the time off and trips to Cambridge will be less than a guilty fine + insurance premium increase. You can also consider finding a local paralegal and see if their costs are more or less than your trips/time-off. Set Fine: http://www.ontariocourts.ca/ocj/how-do- ... hedule-43/ Victim Surcharge: http://www.e-laws.gov.on.ca/html/regs/e ... 0161_e.htm Court Costs: http://www.e-laws.gov.on.ca/html/regs/e ... 0945_e.htm
The insurance companies have to pay for your driving abstracts, and they do this around the time of your renewal. If you've had a clean record for several years, the insurance company loses money paying for your abstract... so they choose not to get it. That money can be better spent on an at/higher risk driver (ie. male, 16yr, brampton, speeding, at-fault accident).
You'll have to look at your insurance policy, some people get conviction free discounts of 15%. If you get convicted for speeding, you'll lose those discounts and they may add another +10% per conviction. State Farm cancels policies on a third minor conviction within a three year window.
It's always better to request disclosure, and request a trial to maximize your opportunities of having the charges withdrawn due to technicalities. You'll have to look at your finances, and decide whether the time off and trips to Cambridge will be less than a guilty fine + insurance premium increase. You can also consider finding a local paralegal and see if their costs are more or less than your trips/time-off.
I got a speeding ticket Eastbound 401 east of Brooksale Ave just past Cornwall. He was sitting on the right side and unmarked hidden by tall bushes on a right bend in the road.He spoke with a strong French accent. He said "I reduced the speed to save you some points" The ticket says 120km in a posted 100km zone $95 ticket. It shows R checked with 129 over it. A 3 point ticket reduced to a 3 point ticket so I found out later. Who cares about a km reduction when it does nothing about the points! He spelled my first name wrong but anyone looking at it can easily make correction. The Paralegal said they make the R so that the prosecutor doesn't have to make a deal. I live in Newmarket and a 4 1/2 hour drive to Cornwall. My frienddid the disclosure thing and said he would like to go through proper procedure and receive it by registered mail. he never got the registered mail and went back to court and had it tossed. But he did this in Toronto. Is there any way to beat this ticket. Thanks Switchbacker Is there any way to beat this? Is there any way to beat this
I got a speeding ticket Eastbound 401 east of Brooksale Ave just past Cornwall. He was sitting on the right side and unmarked hidden by tall bushes
on a right bend in the road.He spoke with a strong French accent. He said "I reduced the speed to save you some points"
The ticket says 120km in a posted 100km zone $95 ticket. It shows R checked with 129 over it.
A 3 point ticket reduced to a 3 point ticket so I found out later. Who cares about a km reduction when it does nothing
about the points! He spelled my first name wrong but anyone looking at it can easily make correction.
The Paralegal said they make the R so that the prosecutor doesn't have to make a deal.
I live in Newmarket and a 4 1/2 hour drive to Cornwall. My frienddid the disclosure thing and said he would like to go
through proper procedure and receive it by registered mail. he never got the registered mail and went back to court and had it tossed.
But he did this in Toronto. Is there any way to beat this ticket.
Saving the $30-$40 in a fine is probably more useful than avoiding the points. For the everyday driver, points are useless. They expire within 2 years. Unless you are a novice driver or you plan on getting pulled over every other month, I wouldn't lose any sleep over the points.
switchbacker wrote:
A 3 point ticket reduced to a 3 point ticket so I found out later. Who cares about a km reduction when it does nothing
about the points!
Saving the $30-$40 in a fine is probably more useful than avoiding the points. For the everyday driver, points are useless. They expire within 2 years. Unless you are a novice driver or you plan on getting pulled over every other month, I wouldn't lose any sleep over the points.
I sat on this a bit too long. My court date is Feb 9th (it crept up on me!) and I just sent an email asking for disclosure today. I got an automated email back saying they received my disclosure request, so that is proof that they got my request. The unfortunate thing is I have to go in person to pick it up once it is ready, and that is in Kitchener. Meanwhile, I live in Toronto and work full-time during the day. I requested the following: - a full copy of the police officers notes (typed if not legible) - a copy of both sides of the officer's copy of the ticket (offence notice) - type, name and model # of speed detection device the officer used - copy of the manual for the speed detection device - calibration records for the speed detection device - certificate or information showing the officers training in using the device - maintenance record for the device used - any other evidence the Crown plans to use in court After looking at the disclosure and I see there are no possible holes, is it better to just pay the fine if I feel attending court is too inconvenient? My primary concern is insurance rates going up. As I understand it, the insurance company does not care about demerit points, nor how much the fine was or how fast you were speeding. A conviction is a conviction to them, whether 1km/hour over or 38km/hour over, is that correct? I would attend court if the insurance company does consider your speed and see if I could get the km reduced. I understand that even if there are no holes in the disclosure, I could get off if the officer does not show up (which I also understand is rare, particularly in a place like Kitchener). In this case, do I plead not guilty up to the point of my trial being called to the stand (usually, they let you know the officer didn't show only at this stage, right?)? If I find the officer is there, is it possible at this stage to change my plea to guilty with explanation and try to get a reduced fine, or is it too late by the time you are called up? My final question is that I am considering hiring a paralegal because of the hassle of going to Kitchener during the work day. Is this a wise idea, and approx much to do they normally charge?
I sat on this a bit too long. My court date is Feb 9th (it crept up on me!) and I just sent an email asking for disclosure today. I got an automated email back saying they received my disclosure request, so that is proof that they got my request. The unfortunate thing is I have to go in person to pick it up once it is ready, and that is in Kitchener. Meanwhile, I live in Toronto and work full-time during the day.
I requested the following:
- a full copy of the police officers notes (typed if not legible)
- a copy of both sides of the officer's copy of the ticket (offence notice)
- type, name and model # of speed detection device the officer used
- copy of the manual for the speed detection device
- calibration records for the speed detection device
- certificate or information showing the officers training in using the device
- maintenance record for the device used
- any other evidence the Crown plans to use in court
After looking at the disclosure and I see there are no possible holes, is it better to just pay the fine if I feel attending court is too inconvenient? My primary concern is insurance rates going up. As I understand it, the insurance company does not care about demerit points, nor how much the fine was or how fast you were speeding. A conviction is a conviction to them, whether 1km/hour over or 38km/hour over, is that correct? I would attend court if the insurance company does consider your speed and see if I could get the km reduced. I understand that even if there are no holes in the disclosure, I could get off if the officer does not show up (which I also understand is rare, particularly in a place like Kitchener). In this case, do I plead not guilty up to the point of my trial being called to the stand (usually, they let you know the officer didn't show only at this stage, right?)? If I find the officer is there, is it possible at this stage to change my plea to guilty with explanation and try to get a reduced fine, or is it too late by the time you are called up?
My final question is that I am considering hiring a paralegal because of the hassle of going to Kitchener during the work day. Is this a wise idea, and approx much to do they normally charge?
I just got my disclosure, but not all of what I requested. I'd like some help deciphering it (see images below), and seeing if there are any holes in the evidence. I am trying to figure out if I would be able to fight this ticket entirely, or plead for a lesser charge.. or if I should just hire a paralegal to deal with all of this for me since the location is so inconvenient (I live in Toronto and the trial is in Kitchener. I was quoted $350 by one company, but they mentioned they would file for a trial and request disclosure as part of it, but I've already done that, so I imagine I can get some cost knocked off). Also, should I ask for the missing info (I am thinking in particular the training records for the officer)? And do I need to view the complete device manual? I had asked for: - a full copy of the police officers notes (typed if not legible) - a copy of both sides of the officer's copy of the ticket (offence notice) - type, name and model # of speed detection device the officer used - copy of the manual for the speed detection device - calibration records for the speed detection device - certificate or information showing the officers training in using the device - maintenance record for the device used - any other evidence the Crown plans to use in court They replied with: "Disclosure and testing pages are attached. Please be advised that you are welcome to attend at our office to review the complete manual; should you wish to do so, please arrange a mutually convenient appointment time with our office by contacting the number below. We have no calibration or maintenance records to disclose. All else is covered." This is all I got: Thanks in advance for any help!
I just got my disclosure, but not all of what I requested. I'd like some help deciphering it (see images below), and seeing if there are any holes in the evidence. I am trying to figure out if I would be able to fight this ticket entirely, or plead for a lesser charge.. or if I should just hire a paralegal to deal with all of this for me since the location is so inconvenient (I live in Toronto and the trial is in Kitchener. I was quoted $350 by one company, but they mentioned they would file for a trial and request disclosure as part of it, but I've already done that, so I imagine I can get some cost knocked off). Also, should I ask for the missing info (I am thinking in particular the training records for the officer)? And do I need to view the complete device manual?
I had asked for:
- a full copy of the police officers notes (typed if not legible)
- a copy of both sides of the officer's copy of the ticket (offence notice)
- type, name and model # of speed detection device the officer used
- copy of the manual for the speed detection device
- calibration records for the speed detection device
- certificate or information showing the officers training in using the device
- maintenance record for the device used
- any other evidence the Crown plans to use in court
They replied with:
"Disclosure and testing pages are attached.
Please be advised that you are welcome to attend at our office to review the complete manual; should you wish to do so, please arrange a mutually convenient appointment time with our office by contacting the number below.
We have no calibration or maintenance records to disclose.
You received everything you should expect in disclosure. Some of the items you asked for simply don't exist or won't be provided. Assuming the officer is competent in giving evidence, everything required for a conviction is in his or her notes. I see no benefit in hiring a paralegal unless you plan to fight the charge outright. You'll likely pay more for their services then you would save with a reduced fine. The only exception would be if your insurance provider considers 35+ over a major conviction, in which case a reduced speeding ticket would save you in terms of insurance. Probably too late now, but did you consider an early resolution meeting? Some jurisdictions allow them to be done over the phone. You could possibly plead to a reduced speed without needing to attend Court.
You received everything you should expect in disclosure. Some of the items you asked for simply don't exist or won't be provided. Assuming the officer is competent in giving evidence, everything required for a conviction is in his or her notes.
I see no benefit in hiring a paralegal unless you plan to fight the charge outright. You'll likely pay more for their services then you would save with a reduced fine. The only exception would be if your insurance provider considers 35+ over a major conviction, in which case a reduced speeding ticket would save you in terms of insurance.
Probably too late now, but did you consider an early resolution meeting? Some jurisdictions allow them to be done over the phone. You could possibly plead to a reduced speed without needing to attend Court.
I followed the procedures mentioned in the previous threads regarding the disclosure and received it today. My court date is November 5 2009 in Whitby. After going through the notes I realized 2 things:
1- the notes are horribly illegible and difficult to read
2- I have notes from two different officers.
Now I am not sure if this means that both the officers will be at court for the hearing or…
I hope I can paint the picture with the accuracy that the truth deserves. I have no intention of just beating a ticket.. but more like beating a really unfair ticket. You decide!
I had entered Canada after a short trip downsouth through Detroit on my way to Toronto. Not being equipped with a GPS unit I had to rely on the printable poorman's version from Mapquest. I followed Huron Church Rd.,…
Need an expert advice here. 10 days ago I got a speeding ticket. Ticket has a fatal error on its face-offense not known to law. It says speeding 75km/hr in posted 60km/hr zone. What is the best way to proceed?
1. Should I completely ignore this ticket and let the JP to quash it?
2. Should I go with option 3 - request a trial and force the fatal error by not showing up at court?
My name is Brian. I am in my late 20s and live in Toronto. I do not own a car but half a dozen times a year I rent one with my Visa. (To get out of the city and go to a beach or ski for example.)
I have never drunk and drive but I face a problem and Im wondering if anyone can tell me what to do. Several months ago I was at a weekend party and had quit a bit to consume. When I stopped…
I was travelling east bound on ellesmere road and approached markham road attempting to make a right turn. All signal lights were red and cars traveling down markham road south were given the green arrow. I slowed down and attempted to make the right turn. I got ticketed by a cop who was parked in a gas station facing the intersection in a (no parking zone). I…
Crested a hill, officer coming at me, pulled a u turn and pulled me over.
I will go back and look again but I thought I was in an 80 not a 70 and I am positive I wasn't doing more than 120. My speedo read 110-115. I have aftermarket tires and rims so I assume this would be the difference.
It was around 7pm, already dark, nobody on the road but myself,…
I am looking for the case law that is commonly used when the prosecution says they only need to disclose the testing pages of a radar manual or laser manual.
I am only interested in the binding decisions (appeals court or higher?), and not in the non-binding Justice of the Peace decisions.
I was pulled over two nights ago and charged with failing to stop a stop sign. On the ticket, it says 'disobey stop sign - foil to stop' and does not say 'fail' -- something I think may be a fatal flaw? I have been driving for 12 years with no tickets, yet I live in Brampton where insurance prices are high so I do not want to be convicted as my insurance rates will spike significantly and…
A friend of mine (who is from China and with no knowledge of English at all) asked me to interpret for him on court.
He got pulled over by a stealth patrol car last october, got 3 tickets (fail to show insurance card, using cell phones and fail to stop on right for emergency vehicle) , court date is next week. He told me his insurance expired for less than a month and other charges are false…
I understand the severity of my offences, and I can't stress how much I regret it. I know I endangered the lives of myself and more importantly others. I usually do not speed and I know running late for work is an unacceptable excuse. I will be a man and accept the consequences of my actions although I would appreciate any advice for my situation.
Guys back in january i got a speeding ticket on dvp, but i am 90% sure he did not caught me on radar, i asked for disclosure request and i just received today, I have asked for: a full copy of the police officers notes, a copy of both sides of the officers copy of the ticket, witness will say statements, speed gun manual, calibration record, repair history and officer's training certificate but…
I need some help here. So today I was on my way to get my tires changed from my winter tires to my regular summer staggered set of tires. I was driving in mississauga on my way to my destination, I got pulled over by an officer where I was given a ticket for having improper mudguards. For some context, I drive a stock 2013 C63 AMG with winter tires at the time. I was never…
I'd like to start this off by saying for the last two weeks I have been browsing the forums. I'm trying to prepare myself for an early resolution meeting with a prosecutor (in Brampton, if that matters). I have a clean record and as a teacher, I always do my best to follow rules (trying to practice what I preach!)
On December 4, 2014 I was preparing to turn right at a very busy intersection.…
I have question, today I was going to work in my normal route there is a triangle intersection with my side being the only one with a stop sign.
There's a car in front me who stopped at the stop sign, and the third-side there's a incoming car with their hazard-light flashing but they don't have stop sign, yet coming in at a slow speed.
Right after the car in front me went through the stop sign,…
On my way to work this morning I received a ticket for disobey sign. I was on Hwy 10 Mississauga in the right lane. The right lane leads to the 401 and there is a sign saying Right Lane Exits. I Tried to merge left before the on ramp as did 3 other people. We all got a ticket for doing that. Is there anything I can do? I did not realize I was breaking any law it was a dotted line where I tried to…
This is my first post, before I jump right in I would like to thank the forum, members, posters and moderators for all the information posted. I feel like I have been able to learn a lot from others experiences, so thank you all.
This will be a lengthy post. But if you are dealing with a Disobey Sign HTA 182(2) - No Straight Through Intersection you may find this extremely…
Let me start this with saying that this isn't in regards to a ticket, more a discussion surrounding front license plates and learning about the rules behind them. (Most of the quote stuff is using colloquial terms, mostly because I couldn't really find a better way to describe it; it's not meant to be offensive.)
I know Ontario law/HTA mandates having a front license plate unlike some States in…
Hi Guys! I've just had my trial day yesterday. I was not at fault but was convicted anyways.
It is such a travesty! There is no justice at the traffic court. It is just a no mercy machine to part someone with his money, no common sense applies and no reasonable argument being considered. Such a shame! The justice, the policeman and the prosecutor ganged up against me. The justice kept interrupting…
Well first of all ... glad to have found the forum - hoping to find answers to 'alot' of questions
I was unfortunate in July 2010 in that I ended up rolling my 2009 Ranger three times, through a fence and landing on the roof on a rained-out road that was/is in need of proper repair in Eastern Ontario.
I was assisted out of the vehicle by the driver who was behind me.
I was traveling down the 401, noticed a speed trap, and started flashing my lights -- in order to warn oncoming drivers.
Within a 30 seconds, a car slowed, crossed the grass, and approached me from behind. Lights appeared, and I then realised that this was an officer in an undercover car.
The officer pulled me over, and while he was polite, clearly his motivation was to…
Does anyone know the specific law, statute, Charter right to refer to when a prosecutor or justice attempts to change the charge on a ticket after a trial has begun? I assume I'd object immediately (without interrupting anyone, of course) but what would be the specific legal basis of my objection?
I was right behind a school bus that looked like it was pulling over to the side in order to turn down a side street, I saw no lights so decided to go around (wide street). Was still moving as I was passing, then as I did pass I heard horn and looked back and in fact it was pulling over to p/u school kids (was a block away from my son's school, so just assumed it wouldn't be picking up kids...it…