New HTA laws on the verge of passing in Ontario

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New HTA laws on the verge of passing in Ontario

by: Sonic on
Wed Jun 10, 2015 8:52 pm ... io-streets

Most of them I don't mind, but I find the crosswalk one ridiculous, unless I'm interpreting it wrong. You can't make a right turn until the pedestrian is completely off the road? Even if they're walking to the north side and already passed you on the south? Also, you can't make a left turn if there's anyone on either side of the crosswalk?

That would be ridiculous. Seems like another cash grab at that point if that is the case - you'll significantly impede traffic, especially in busy pedestrian areas with a law like that. You'll have 1 car making a right turn every 2 hours in the core of Toronto... You better hope you don't have a slow walker, because you can't turn until they're off the crosswalk completely...

It seems like it'll be the new speeding, societal standards - given leniency, but if an officer is in the mood, you'll be charged.
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by: Stanton on
Wed Jun 10, 2015 10:01 pm

The article appears to be incorrect. The current proposed bill is here: ... illID=2956
Sections 140 and 176 of the Act are amended to require drivers to remain stopped at a pedestrian crossover or school crossing until the person crossing the street and the school crossing guard are off the roadway. The current Act allows drivers to proceed once the person crossing and the school crossing guard are no longer on the drivers half of the roadway.

Other amendments to section 140 of the Act consolidate the duties of drivers and pedestrians at pedestrian crossovers: drivers must stop before entering the crossover and not overtake another vehicle already stopped at the crossover; pedestrians (which includes persons in wheelchairs) must not enter a crossover and into the path of a vehicle or street car that is so close that the driver cannot stop.

"Pedestrian crossover" means any portion of a roadway distinctly indicated for pedestrian crossing by signs on the highway and lines or other markings on the surface of the roadway as prescribed by the regulations
I read that as meaning the law applies to designated pedestrian crossovers (not all crosswalks) and that they'll require markings on the road AND signage. I think the most common example of this is where the pedestrian can activate the flashing amber lights above the roadway and vehicles are required to yield.

I agree that if it applied to all crosswalks it would simply create gridlock in any major urban area.
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by: Radar Identified on
Wed Jun 10, 2015 11:26 pm

Agree with Stanton, it appears to refer to crossovers only, not all crosswalks. It's more about the Liberals trying to say "hey look we're making it safer for pedestrians" than anything else. The media usually gets part of it correct but not all of it, as we see here... since they get money by generating readership and advertising revenue, providing highly accurate and clear information often isn't their forte.

If they made it for all crosswalks, cops in most urban areas (especially Toronto) wouldn't enforce it and drivers would ignore it.

EDIT: Should add, the HTA differentiates between "Crossover" and "Crosswalk." The "pedestrian shall be fully off" refers to crossovers only, in the legislative amendment link Stanton posted. Looks like turning when the pedestrian is out of the way at a crosswalk is still okay, unless there's a School Crossing Guard. I can live with that.
* The above is NOT legal advice. By acting on anything I have said, you assume responsibility for any outcome and consequences. * OR
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by: Sonic on
Fri Jun 12, 2015 6:44 am

Yeah, both of you seem to be right. The article I was looking at seemed to suggest that all cross*walks* would be included, so I got worried for a second. Thankfully, that doesn't seem to be the case.

In regards to crossovers, I thought that was always the law so it doesn't make a difference for me. I didn't know you could pass through those designated walkways as soon as a pedestrian passes while the lights are flashing, my driving instructor always told me I had to wait until they leave the road... Imagine the cumulative seconds I could have saved!
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by: hecubus on
Sat Jun 13, 2015 2:40 pm

The "article" is incorrect in at least one other area. The article contains the statements:

"If the bill passes, only school buses could be this colour of yellow, so some tacky muscle cars may need a paint job. (Associated Press)

The bill would also "clarify that only school buses can be painted chrome yellow." One has to wonder what, exactly, necessitated that clarification."

However, the bill proposes:

41 .  (1)  Subsection 175 (3) of the Act is amended by striking out "No bus" at the beginning and substituting "No part of a bus".
   (2)  Section 175 of the Act is amended by adding the following subsection:
   (3.1)  If all or part of a bus registered in Ontario is painted chrome yellow, the bus shall also display on its front and rear the words "school bus" and on its rear the words "do not pass when signals flashing".
   (3)  Subsection 175 (5) of the Act is repealed and the following substituted:
Driving motor vehicle, subss. (3), (3.1) and (4)
   (5)  No person shall drive or operate a motor vehicle on a highway that contravenes subsection (3), (3.1) or (4)."

The key phrase being: "If all or part of a bus registered in Ontario is painted chrome yellow", so the section does not apply to cars; only buses (registered in Ontario).
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