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Re: Plugging My Cell Phone in at Stop Light
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 27, 2016 10:21 am 
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It was actually flat on my cup holder. My cup holders are filled with gum packs for my kids, and so I lay it flat on there while driving. So I could potentially just shove the plug into it without holding it....


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Re: Plugging My Cell Phone in at Stop Light
PostPosted: Tue Sep 27, 2016 11:50 am 
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Potentially?
Did you have the phone in your hand or not? (you don't have to answer my question but you will have to answer the crown when they ask you).
More importantly, is it possible that the officer saw you with the phone in your hand?
Most importantly, can you get the officer to say, on the stand, that he did not see you with the phone in your hand?


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Re: Plugging My Cell Phone in at Stop Light
PostPosted: Tue Sep 27, 2016 1:36 pm 
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I had my phone in my hand, and plugged it in... I was at a stop light (a long one) and literally plugged it in and shook the wire until it buzzed to show me it was charging. I know I did it... I'm not saying I didn't... but I wasn't aware that I wasn't allowed to even "touch" my phone while at a stop light (I also know that saying you didn't know it was illegal isn't a good enough excuse). I'm just looking for a possible reduction in the fine, or a mistake in my file to not have to pay. I don't text and drive and I drive safely, and it's really upsetting to pay a fine for literally plugging in my phone while at a long stop light.
I will mail my ticket in and request a trial, and request the officers notes and see what they say. As mentioned above, I can always choose to plead guilty the day of the trial, correct? I'm really just hoping for a reduction, because the officer even said (after he handed me the ticket and after he saw I was crying) that I can take it to court if I disagreed with it since I was at a full stop and I was only plugging it in. It was almost like he was suggesting that I go that route...


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Re: Plugging My Cell Phone in at Stop Light
PostPosted: Tue Sep 27, 2016 1:56 pm 
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Yes you can plead guilty on the day of trial if you do not want to fight it. But you need at least a couple weeks to review disclosure, so if you get it within two weeks of the trial you can show up and ask JP to adjourn it to another date as you need time to review the disclosure and prepare your defense. Again you can still plead guilty at anytime.

The prosecutor may offer you some kind of plea deal with a reduced fine, however remember it will STILL affect your insurance.

If you take it to trial and try to fight it and lose, then the prosecutor will probably ask for full fine, however you can still ask JP for reduced fine and they may or may not do it.

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+++ This is not legal advice, only my opinion +++


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Re: Plugging My Cell Phone in at Stop Light
PostPosted: Tue Sep 27, 2016 2:55 pm 
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So worst case scenario is I have to pay the full fine and waste my time going to court.... best case scenario, I get a reduced fine (or some miracle happens and get it thrown out)....


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Re: Plugging My Cell Phone in at Stop Light
PostPosted: Tue Sep 27, 2016 4:55 pm 
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Read these two short decisions in full to better understand how HTA S78.1 "Drive – hand-held communication device" is being interpreted in ON courts today.

R. v. Pizzurro, 2013 ONCA 584
http://canlii.ca/t/g0qn3

R. v. Kazemi, 2013 ONCA 585
http://canlii.ca/t/g0qn4

It may be in your best interest to invest in a windshield or car-vent clip type mount for your hand-held device; had it been securely mounted, you could have legally attached the power-cable to your phone.

ONTARIO REGULATION 366/09 - DISPLAY SCREENS AND HAND-HELD DEVICES
https://www.ontario.ca/laws/regulation/090366
Quote:
Exemption for pressing buttons
14. (1) A person may drive a motor vehicle on a highway while pressing a button on a hand-held wireless communication device to make, answer or end a cell phone call or to transmit or receive voice communication on a two-way radio if the device is placed securely in or mounted to the motor vehicle so that it does not move while the vehicle is in motion and the driver can see it at a quick glance and easily reach it without adjusting his or her driving position. O. Reg. 366/09, s. 14 (1).

(2) A person may drive a motor vehicle on a highway while pressing a button on a device that is worn on his or her head or hung over or placed inside his or her ear or is attached to his or her clothing and is linked to a hand-held wireless communication device to make, answer or end a cell phone call or to transmit or receive voice communication on a two-way radio or a hand microphone or portable radio. O. Reg. 366/09, s. 14 (2).

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Re: Plugging My Cell Phone in at Stop Light
PostPosted: Mon Nov 28, 2016 1:20 pm 
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Hi All,
I got my date for court. Can anyone tell me how to get in touch with the prosecutor if their name isn't on this form? And they didn't even sign it.

Thanks!!
Stephanie


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Re: Plugging My Cell Phone in at Stop Light
PostPosted: Mon Nov 28, 2016 1:36 pm 
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Sadly, the fact that the prosecutor didn't sign it is irrelevant. The clerk has certified that he or she gave a copy personally to the prosecutor. You would have to prove otherwise.

Now that you have your trial date, you should request disclosure. Courts may have different procedures. You should contact the court to find out how to submit your request. With any luck, the court will accept an e-mailed request. I'll save you the search: the court's phone number is 613-580-2665.


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Re: Plugging My Cell Phone in at Stop Light
PostPosted: Mon Nov 28, 2016 2:16 pm 
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in the UK, some people got done for eating, under distraction laws.
basically anything OTHER than driving could cause a distraction.

A phone more so, due to the way it effects your brain (proved)
eating or talking not so, but if your not in full control of your car
then your distracted

waterskiiichick wrote:
Just out of curiosity, what about peeling a banana at a stop light? That would have been more distracting and taken me more time than plugging my cell phone in.... :(


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Re: Plugging My Cell Phone in at Stop Light
PostPosted: Mon Nov 28, 2016 2:24 pm 
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If you need disclosure, ask for it. If you need a fax, email, etc for the prosecution office, you can contact the court house and find out. You can also do it in person. They may have a generic disclosure request form you can fill out also.

Ottawa [0460]

100 Constellation Crescent
Ottawa, ON K2G 6J8
[Map]

Phone: 613-580-2665
Fax: 613-580-2664
Email: provincialoffences@ottawa.ca

Website


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Re: Plugging My Cell Phone in at Stop Light
PostPosted: Mon Nov 28, 2016 2:29 pm 
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The address/phone above posted by Bend is for the Provincial Offences Office. Call them and ask for Prosecutor contact info.

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Re: Plugging My Cell Phone in at Stop Light
PostPosted: Mon Nov 28, 2016 2:35 pm 
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It's a bit sad, although I understand the "letter of the law" but moving a cellphone, pluggin it in when stopped or pulled over, popping a chocolate in your mouth, is totally different from someone holding a phone to the head and talking?
or even texting, totally understand it's dangerous and distracting

But surely just pluggin it in, or moving it, thats harsh.
We have to multi task in out cars all the time, keeping kids quite, directions, messing with the heater controls, mirrors, a load of things

this is even in the UK, so not having a dig at anyone, but seriously...... can understand why people get pi$$ed off


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Re: Plugging My Cell Phone in at Stop Light
PostPosted: Mon Nov 28, 2016 3:11 pm 
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waterskiiichick wrote:
I was stopped at a stop light (it was a long stop light at big intersection) and remembered my battery on my cell was running low (I'm a mother of 3 young kids and having cell battery is important), so I plugged it in, noticed the plug was fraying, fiddled with it for about 5 seconds to confirm it was actually charging, and set it down. I didn't even turn it on, and I got a $490 fine!
The cop even said that I can go to court if I disagree because I was at a stop light and just plugging it in....

If I go to court, should I plead guilty but ask for a reduced fine, or should I go the trial route?

Need some advice here because I wasn't even on my phone and I can't afford $490. :(

I was caught in Quebec 2 years ago for using my phone (that time I was, on the phone with the school when one of my kids was really sick), and I paid that one because I was on my phone, GUILTY, but I learned my lesson..... Would that prior ticket hinder me in court?


The previous offence in Quebec will likely show on your driving record as an Out Of Province conviction. Demerit points are active for 2 years from offence date, and 3rd party (employer/insurance) visibility of the conviction is generally 3 years.

You have likely been charged under HTA s.78.1 for Drive With Handheld Communication Device. This offence carries a 3 demerit point penalty.

Unfortunately this section prohibits even the holding of the device:

"78.1 (1) No person shall drive a motor vehicle on a highway while holding or using a hand-held wireless communication device or other prescribed device that is capable of receiving or transmitting telephone communications, electronic data, mail or text messages. 2009, c. 4, s. 2; 2015, c. 27, Sched. 7, s. 18."

These charges can be fought at court, but they will generally be all-or-nothing defences based on the legal merits of the Prosecutor's evidence. Depending upon the jurisdiction involved, they can sometime be negotiated to a lesser offence.

_________________
The content of this post is not legal advice. Legal advice can only be provided after a licenced paralegal has been retained, spoken with you directly, and reviewed the documents related to your case.


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Re: Plugging My Cell Phone in at Stop Light
PostPosted: Mon Nov 28, 2016 3:20 pm 
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That's all I'm looking for. Yes I plugged in my phone while stopped at a stop light. Yes, under the law I'm guilty, but I'm hoping to get it reduced as I can't afford $500 :(


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Re: Plugging My Cell Phone in at Stop Light
PostPosted: Mon Nov 28, 2016 3:27 pm 
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It's one of those tickets that they are trying to make examples of everybody so they tend not to drop or change the charge if they don't have to.

At any trial, if you are convicted (or if you do Plead Guilty With An Explanation), you will then have the ability to make a submission to the JP about the $$$ penalty. This is when you just tell them how sorry you are and that you learned your lesson and that you don't want to come back again and that you are poor and that you can barely pay your rent and bla bla bla and please consider reducing it to $100 and I will still need 6 months to pay it off.

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